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Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

blog.ethereum.org

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Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#72

I wonder how this will impact mining? Will GPUs suddenly flood the market as it becomes much less profitable to mine? God I hope so the GPU shortages have been crazy.

I've be lurking heavily in the crypto-mining communities for a few weeks now. Most are saying they'll just "move to a new coin" which is basically all they CAN do, unless they cash out early and sell their hardware. Nvidia is releasing* "LHR" (low hash rate) cards to give gamers some relief (assuming they can't be jailbroken).

*https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2021/05/18/lhr/

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Current system is no different, as the hash power is related to how many computers you can afford to buy. This doesn't fix the problem but it does fix the environmental impact.

PoW is a lot different, as burning real world resources (energy) brings sell-pressure to miners, whereas PoS only has cost of locking the funds. This means that regardless of the size of your "operation" cost scales very flat. PoS also does not come with the property of innovation and disruption. In a PoW (especially ASIC-based) system you will find new ways to outperform your peers and disrupt old players. PoW incen…

PoS burns capital in the sense that it could be invested in something else (I was looking at staking coins but it doesn't come near the yield I get from my 401k for example, which is effectively providing unsecured debt to finance innovation.)

IMO: it's much better than PoW as long as it doesn't end up too centralized. I'm not too sure how I feel about the minimum amount required to stake though, that seems a bit odd.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#74
post #35
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I myself stay with Bitcoin, Ethereum still has lots of advantages compared to the fiat system: it's still open source, and people can still validate the rules (although that full validation is extremely hard). Also the current fiat system is debt based, which means that the vast majority of money is printed by banks and the money printing power is at the highest ranking sales person, and hidden.

In a well functioning democratic society, the money printing is ultimately under democratic control. Don't lie.

I had banker friends bragging me getting sex for approving low interest loans. I'm not sure what democratic control are you talking about, loans are approved by people.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#75
Maybe this is a good time and place to ask - let's say I want to buy something using Ethereum. Is it correct that when I look at, say, https://ycharts.com/indicators/ethereum_average_transaction_... , you have to pay USD 20 just as payment fees? I wrote off Bitcoin as a payment mechanism a long time ago because of this (although it seems BTC tx costs are now lower than ETH?), is this the direction tx costs for all crypto coins go?

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Current system is no different, as the hash power is related to how many computers you can afford to buy. This doesn't fix the problem but it does fix the environmental impact.

No, it is very different because in practice the pools and exchanges are totally separate entities. With PoS the biggest holders will be exchanges and therefore exchanges will control the cryptocurrency. With PoS there will be clearly less decentralization compared to PoW.

For some reason China seems to concentrate more than 50% of hashing rate due to "big money" coming in and building up huge data centers while using the dirty local energy available.

How's that decentralized.

The times of home mining with CPU/GPUs are long gone

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#77
I feel like ETH is in very good footing to move to Proof of Space (decentralized network, good dev work, lots of distributed stake), especially in comparison to other projects that have gone with PoS. I'm sure it'll succeed in many ways, but I can't imagine moving away from Nakamoto consensus is going to be "the solution" generally for how to create a working, scalable, well distributed currency.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#78
post #13

> Several teams of engineers are working overtime to ensure that The Merge arrives as soon as possible, and without compromising on safety. Overworking your engineers will most definitely lead to compromises. But good to see that Ethereum came to their senses and are serious about reducing the environmental impact they have.

No it doesnt. Having hard time/budget/whatever constraints does. Otherwise, theoretically you can "overwork" i.e. (work more than standard 40 hour weeks or some standard of work hours) whatever without compromise

> Otherwise, theoretically you can "overwork" i.e. (work more than standard 40 hour weeks or some standard of work hours) whatever without compromise

That's simply not true. Humans aren't machines. Productivity falls off a cliff after 50 hours, and after 55 you may as well not even be in the office. There are diminishing returns with "overwork"ing.

[0] https://siepr.stanford.edu/research/publications/productivit...

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#79
post #75

Maybe this is a good time and place to ask - let's say I want to buy something using Ethereum. Is it correct that when I look at, say, https://ycharts.com/indicators/ethereum_average_transaction_... , you have to pay USD 20 just as payment fees? I wrote off Bitcoin as a payment mechanism a long time ago because of this (although it seems BTC tx costs are now lower than ETH?), is this the direction tx costs for all cr…

That chart is highly misleading, as it includes all smart contracts. In ETH a basic transfer (like BTC) is often cheap (although it needs to be even less!), however interacting with a smart contract can be more expensive. If you want to interact with a highly complex smart contract that pulls a lot of state it can be 100x the cost of a basic transfer... just depends on the code.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#80
I know this is a pressing matter, and that has relevance for itself, but after the whole Elon Musk thing it just turns this into a reply to his tweet, where so many cryptos folks were spamming "we use less energy then bitcoin! choose us! we're open to talk!"

Which in the lights of the recent events sounds like: "pump us this time around!"

Makes you question: when would be a good time to address this, if they can't time travel to the day before Elon posted the tweet?

And I don't know the answer to that. Was this too soon? Well if they want to take the ride of Elon controversy, I don't think so. Is that a good thing? Who knows.

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