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Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

blog.ethereum.org

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Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#51

Post by ballofrubber »

sergioisidoro wrote: post #3
focom wrote: post #2

So with PoS, we recreate a system where a few rich pool have decision over the network. Can someone enlighten me on how this is different from the current fiat system?

Current system is no different, as the hash power is related to how many computers you can afford to buy. This doesn't fix the problem but it does fix the environmental impact.

PoW is a lot different, as burning real world resources (energy) brings sell-pressure to miners, whereas PoS only has cost of locking the funds. This means that regardless of the size of your "operation" cost scales very flat.

PoS also does not come with the property of innovation and disruption. In a PoW (especially ASIC-based) system you will find new ways to outperform your peers and disrupt old players.

PoW incentivices cheap energy in developing countries more than anything before. It is the fix for environmental problems.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#52

Post by KptMarchewa »

michael_vo wrote: post #32

What are the attack vectors on PoS. With PoW you need 51% of the mining power to take over the system, which is very labor intensive to set up. With PoS could you take over all coins by buying 51% of the existing coins? So if the market cap of ETH is 200BB spend 100BB to double your money?

>So if the market cap of ETH is 200BB spend 100BB to double your money?

No one would buy those from you, so at best you can burn money to burn other people's money at a premium.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#53

Post by yokem55 »

gruez wrote: post #6
sergioisidoro wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Current system is no different, as the hash power is related to how many computers you can afford to buy. This doesn't fix the problem but it does fix the environmental impact.

The difference is that with PoW you constantly have to do "stuff" (ie. buying equipment, running datacenters) or get left behind. PoS on the other hand you can just sit on your ass and wait for the $$$ to roll in.

Except, using the same kind of pooling that POW depends on, you can still get in at just about any price level. .01 Eth can be staked just as easily as 10,000 eth. And running a validator with 32 isn't nothing - you still have to keep a machine on and online 24/7 with an uncapped connection or pay someone to host that machine.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#54

Post by intotheabyss »

secondcoming wrote: post #11
xiphias2 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I myself stay with Bitcoin, Ethereum still has lots of advantages compared to the fiat system: it's still open source, and people can still validate the rules (although that full validation is extremely hard). Also the current fiat system is debt based, which means that the vast majority of money is printed by banks and the money printing power is at the highest ranking sales person, and hidden.

Have you ever actually used an Ethereum in real life outside of price speculation?

Not OP, but I literally use Ethereum every day and have been for like 2 years now. I started using dapps in 2016, but in 2019 is when the network had a sufficient amount of things to do that I found myself using it daily.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#55

Post by jMyles »

gspr wrote: post #35
xiphias2 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I myself stay with Bitcoin, Ethereum still has lots of advantages compared to the fiat system: it's still open source, and people can still validate the rules (although that full validation is extremely hard). Also the current fiat system is debt based, which means that the vast majority of money is printed by banks and the money printing power is at the highest ranking sales person, and hidden.

In a well functioning democratic society, the money printing is ultimately under democratic control. Don't lie.

If I understand correctly, that has never happened with fiat money ever in the history of humanity, though.

Hence the impetus to try something different and more befitting the future of our species.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#56

Post by NikolaeVarius »

ysavir wrote: post #48
NikolaeVarius wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it doesnt. Having hard time/budget/whatever constraints does. Otherwise, theoretically you can "overwork" i.e. (work more than standard 40 hour weeks or some standard of work hours) whatever without compromise

On paper, sure. In practice, having people overworked leads to compromises you never intend to make, simply due to exhaustion and burden clouding judgement values.

Thats a problem of process where errors are caught.

It makes things more inefficient, but it doesn't compromise final quality assuming issues are found and addressed.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#57

Post by kemonocode »

gspr wrote: post #35
xiphias2 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I myself stay with Bitcoin, Ethereum still has lots of advantages compared to the fiat system: it's still open source, and people can still validate the rules (although that full validation is extremely hard). Also the current fiat system is debt based, which means that the vast majority of money is printed by banks and the money printing power is at the highest ranking sales person, and hidden.

In a well functioning democratic society, the money printing is ultimately under democratic control. Don't lie.

Truly, as you say, "in a well functioning democratic society", which is not the case for a not so insignificant proportion of the world.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#58

Post by vmception »

thefourthchime wrote: post #7

Wasn’t Casper going to do this like four years ago? They have been talking about moving to PoS forever now. It still hasn’t happened.

I like how these kinds of quips will evaporate

I just wonder what the next criticism will be

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#59

Post by wing-_-nuts »

AAA_Rating wrote: post #9

Its price will also tumble 99% . People motives to get into crypto are clear. They want to subtract themselves from government policy of constantly printing money. BTC takes care of that and it's a 14 years brand which is extremely politically expensive to make illegal On the other hand people are perfectly satisfied with their experience on Youtube, Amazon, Google, Facebook, Ebay, JPMorgan etc. which are the entitie…

>Its price will also tumble 99%

From your lips to God's ears. If the price falls steeply there will be a glut of gpus flooding the market and I'll finally be able to build a pc.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#60

Post by sp332 »

michael_vo wrote: post #32

What are the attack vectors on PoS. With PoW you need 51% of the mining power to take over the system, which is very labor intensive to set up. With PoS could you take over all coins by buying 51% of the existing coins? So if the market cap of ETH is 200BB spend 100BB to double your money?

You have to find some people willing to sell you that much ETH. Market depth around the current price is obviously not that deep and it would at least cost way more if you could even find that much for sale anywhere.
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