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$365B wiped off cryptocurrency market after Tesla stops accepting Bitcoin

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Re: $365B wiped off cryptocurrency market after Tesla stops accepting Bitcoin

#221

Post by robertlagrant »

uncomputation wrote: post #59
marsrover wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing makes me happier than to see someone act so condescending about "buying drugs online" while at the same time being so out of touch with reality. Well, nothing other than the fact that I'm a millionaire today because I decided to buy drugs online in 2013.

…Congratulations? You didn’t actually address his concerns (although they were troll-y in nature). You just flexed about your own wealth, which just as easily could’ve come from betting on the right stock in 2013. I don’t understand crypto advocates whose only plus-one for crypto is that it made them personally rich. It just as easily could’ve gone nowhere and just because the market happens to be in your favor for n…

Everyone's a genius in a bull market.

Re: $365B wiped off cryptocurrency market after Tesla stops accepting Bitcoin

#222

Post by Alupis »

mvzvm wrote: post #30
BitwiseFool wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't want the SEC involved in crypto, at all.

I do. Right now it feels like a carnival full of carnies.

> I do. Right now it feels like a carnival full of carnies.

With people making fortunes or losing everything based on one dude's mood and a single tweet.

The SEC and other's exist because of the Robber-Baron's of old... I'm no "Regulation Hawk", but it does seem silly to allow this nonsense to continue.

Re: $365B wiped off cryptocurrency market after Tesla stops accepting Bitcoin

#223

Post by DoingIsLearning »

delaaxe wrote: post #188

You cited everything but the most important regarding this news: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2021/05/private-equity-f... (the reason for his change of mind)

This is the third comment in this thread where you've written the same quote, claiming this is what "changed his mind".

Do you have any evidence of this claim?

I want to keep an open mind and not jump to gaslighting accusations. But something about this thread doesn't sit right.

Re: $365B wiped off cryptocurrency market after Tesla stops accepting Bitcoin

#224

Post by noxer »

totalZero wrote: post #200
noxer wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one suggest they have. As long as they have less than an device that does the same task but uses gas then it reduces emissions. Rockets as well, they pollute but making them reusable pollutes less. Also depending on fuel type its perfectly possible to produce it form solar energy. But DOGE just burns energy it does nothing with it that could not be done without. Its significantly less then Buttcoin but it explodes…

Making rockets reusable uses more fuel but requires more raw materials to be mined, refined, and fabricated into parts. It's a tradeoff. The chief argument for reuse is cost, not emissions.

"More fuel" is irrelevant its about pollution. You can never make parts without using a fix amount of resources and energy and if they are used they will end up as waste which is pollution too. Fuel however is just energy in a specific form. If the fuel is created with electric energy and it all comes form coal then it pollution is high but there is a clear path to reduce it down the line. There is no such path with rockets parts that have to be fabricated again and again and again.

Cost is the reason why it is feasible. But it still reduces pollution. The additional fuel used to land the rocket causes way way less pollution than creating a new one for every launch. Embodied energy (gray energy) is often significantly underestimated. Just transporting the raw material from all around the world to make a final product uses immense amour of energy and very often its in the form of oil. Also down the line the additional fuel to land can be created with low pollution energy so pollution is reduced even further.

Re: $365B wiped off cryptocurrency market after Tesla stops accepting Bitcoin

#225

Post by vardump »

DoingIsLearning wrote: post #223
delaaxe wrote: post #188

You cited everything but the most important regarding this news: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2021/05/private-equity-f... (the reason for his change of mind)

This is the third comment in this thread where you've written the same quote, claiming this is what "changed his mind". Do you have any evidence of this claim? I want to keep an open mind and not jump to gaslighting accusations. But something about this thread doesn't sit right.

Shrug... did some quick Googling and found this:

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1392938133163888640

He might be right.

Re: $365B wiped off cryptocurrency market after Tesla stops accepting Bitcoin

#226

Post by nickik »

orblivion wrote: post #156
sakopov wrote: post #31

Very perplexing behavior from Musk, I must say. Bitcoin's energy consumption has been front-and-center for a few years now and even more so when the bull market got hot. How does Musk decide to throw $1.5 billion worth of Tesla's cash into BTC without acknowledging this? I was expecting a little bit more due-diligence from him, but he's been absolutely consumed by crypto markets in general.

Okay, here's my Big Brain, 4D Chess take: Elon Musk wanted to adopt Bitcoin, but he knew there was this big problem with energy consumption. It's bad for his brand, and perhaps goes against his own ethics. Could he say "hey, get the energy consumption down and I'll go all-in with Tesla"? People wouldn't think much of it. Better option: Buy a huge stake in Bitcoin, announce that he'll be accepting bitcoin at Tesla, ge…

Whenever people start talking about Big Brain 4D Chess I think, probably not it.

Elon is pretty busy, before he got into space flight, he new very little about it. Some people at the time said as much. However 2 years later the same person said he was literally an expert on many things and had learned an insane amount.

This seems more like Elon became convinced of the potential of crypto currency in general, told Tesla to look into it, if it is a viable cash storage and if it is, logically using it for payments make sense.

Then they based on their internal team for evaluation of environment they saw that their entrance in the market caused a massive spike and released if this continues and they continue to drive people in that market it would be damaging for the mission.

It reasonable that they didn't understand how large the increase in power consumption was and how large it would be if it continued to be adopted. So rather then continue to drive in that direction they pulled the plug.

I know, its not a crazy big brain story, but its actually how most flawed process happen.

Re: $365B wiped off cryptocurrency market after Tesla stops accepting Bitcoin

#228

Post by orblivion »

nickik wrote: post #226
orblivion wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, here's my Big Brain, 4D Chess take: Elon Musk wanted to adopt Bitcoin, but he knew there was this big problem with energy consumption. It's bad for his brand, and perhaps goes against his own ethics. Could he say "hey, get the energy consumption down and I'll go all-in with Tesla"? People wouldn't think much of it. Better option: Buy a huge stake in Bitcoin, announce that he'll be accepting bitcoin at Tesla, ge…

Whenever people start talking about Big Brain 4D Chess I think, probably not it. Elon is pretty busy, before he got into space flight, he new very little about it. Some people at the time said as much. However 2 years later the same person said he was literally an expert on many things and had learned an insane amount. This seems more like Elon became convinced of the potential of crypto currency in general, told Tes…

I forgot to consider that he caused the spike in energy usage in the first place. I think this makes more sense.

Re: $365B wiped off cryptocurrency market after Tesla stops accepting Bitcoin

#229

Post by onion2k »

pkulak wrote: post #220
sakopov wrote: post #31

Very perplexing behavior from Musk, I must say. Bitcoin's energy consumption has been front-and-center for a few years now and even more so when the bull market got hot. How does Musk decide to throw $1.5 billion worth of Tesla's cash into BTC without acknowledging this? I was expecting a little bit more due-diligence from him, but he's been absolutely consumed by crypto markets in general.

Cus he's not that bright. Isn't this the elephant in the room that no one wants to consider? Why do we have to start with the assumption that Musk is a genius, then work back from that? The dude thought covid would go away last May. He thinks it's easier to make Mars habitable than it is to keep the Earth habitable. He's thought that full self driving was 6 months away for literally 4 years now. And he didn't really…

SpaceX wins lots of space contracts with the help of Musk's "Occupy Mars" marketing.

Tesla sells lots of cars on the promise of self-driving in the marketing.

Musk bought BTC, single-handedly pumped the price of BTC, and then sold at a huge profit.

I don't think he's a genius but Musk is definitely not stupid. He's just not playing the obvious game you think he's playing.

Re: $365B wiped off cryptocurrency market after Tesla stops accepting Bitcoin

#230

Post by tessierashpool »

slg wrote: post #87
phire wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla might not have dumped. But I'd be very interested to see Musk's personal trading accounts, and the trading accounts of his close associates.

It is incredibly hard to imagine that the upside in Musk's personal Bitcoin stake, whatever it is, is anywhere close to approaching his personal stake in Tesla. Something like 70% of his net worth is Tesla stock. It would be unbelievably stupid to jeopardize the value of the Tesla stock to pump up the value of his Bitcoin holdings. Some of these anti-Musk conspiracy theories are truly crazy especially considering the…

It is incredibly hard to imagine that the upside in Musk's personal Bitcoin stake, whatever it is, is anywhere close to approaching his personal stake in Tesla. Something like 70% of his net worth is Tesla stock. It would be unbelievably stupid to jeopardize the value of the Tesla stock to pump up the value of his Bitcoin holdings.

this is a good point, but if I held Tesla, I would probably prefer cash. it could be that Tesla's greatest value is as a prop for BTC scams.

Teslas catch on fire randomly. Their roofs fall off sometimes. Their self-driving tech doesn't work as well as people expect, and when people get that expectation wrong, it sometimes results in them dying. The bulk of the company's revenue comes from carbon credits.

maybe he's pumping and dumping Bitcoin because he doesn't expect his wealth to last, and if he sold a bunch of Tesla stock, people would notice. a little scam to set aside a nest egg just in case the other scam doesn't pan out.

the weaknesses in this argument are SpaceX and PayPal, so I'm not totally convinced of my own position here, but I haven't seen any good counterarguments otherwise.

he could also just find scams fun for their own sake.

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