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Tesla no longer accepts Bitcoin due to climate impact

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Re: Tesla no longer accepts Bitcoin due to climate impact

#101
post #13
post #3

Hope we now can start a proof of stake cycle. Peercoin is dead. What other proof of stake viable currency is there? Only when the energy impact of crypto currency is dealt with will i indulge in speculating that it can be a net good for humanicy

We need proof of CO2 scrubbing.

Replace the gold standard with the CO2 standard. Tie currency to carbon captured and stored.

Re: Tesla no longer accepts Bitcoin due to climate impact

#102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You used to be able to mine Bitcoin on a CPU. Then a GPU, now it takes warehouses full of ASICs to do it profitably. What's stopping Chia from doing the same thing to the storage space? Adoption. I don't like Chia, and I don't want other people to like it either.

> What's stopping Chia from doing the same thing to the storage space? The gobsmacking amount of HDD supply on earth. For now people are burning SSDs to create the plots (1TB SSD can probably create a petabyte of plots to "farm"), but if you have that petabyte of storage space you're keeping online 24/7, do you suspect playing bingo to win crypto tokens is the most profitable use of that memory? How the economics sha…

This is my issue: the only thing stopping it from becoming the most profitable use of that memory is the market value of Chia.

Chia isn't cool. Chia gives you bad breath, and it makes dogs hate you. Spread the word.

Re: Tesla no longer accepts Bitcoin due to climate impact

#103
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. A very clever plan, executed to perfection. We don't know the price point of the BTC they bought at the time but it is likely to be somewhere around $30,000 - $40,000 and then they announced it to cause a run up close to $60,000 and then sold some of it for a >$101m profit. Now they somehow 'stop accepting Bitcoin' causing BTC to go down 12%. These same institutions are NOT interested in hodling. They are here t…

> executed to perfection Except they still own nearly all the Bitcoin they bought, so I don’t see how selling a tiny bit of it and tanking the rest could be described as “to perfection”.

> Except they still own a ton of Bitcoin

No where in my sentence suggested they sold all of it.

> so I don’t see how selling a tiny bit of it could be described as “to perfection”

Telsa did not lose any money from their BTC investment and are still up >40%. At that time, they (and others on Twitter) caused a run up in the crypto markets to drive the BTC price up to new all time highs and got out a large profit even by selling a small amount and then causing it to drop 12% after the announcement, sounds like it was perfectly executed and it worked for them.

Re: Tesla no longer accepts Bitcoin due to climate impact

#104
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meanwhile they started accepting Dogecoin at SpaceX just couple of days ago . Dogecoin has exactly the same energy spending incentives as Bitcoin. The whole set of actions doesn't sound very logical.

> Dogecoin has exactly the same energy spending incentives as Bitcoin. While the incentives are the same, Dogecoin has roughly 7.4x lower energy requirements than Bitcoin currently, so accepting Dogecoin instead of Bitcoin is a tad less offensive.

With a market cap that is 20 times lower, higher market cap means higher prices, means more miners and thus more energy requirement

Re: Tesla no longer accepts Bitcoin due to climate impact

#105

Just curious as someone out of the loop, what regulations encourage other car companies to buy regulatory credits that Tesla is granted by producing zero emission vehicles? I know its a big part of their profitability. Are there not regulations that would encourage Tesla to buy credits to make up for their crypto-polluting sins?

Talking about the EU perspective in 2020 here: FCA (Fiat Chrysler and all of their brands) sold too few low/zero emission cars. Their fine would have been X millions of €. By paying Tesla X - 100 millions €, they save 100 million €, while being pretty pissed off that they are financing a different OEM.

Due to this reason, they already announced that in 2021 they won't need to "pool" with another OEM like they did in 2020.

Re: Tesla no longer accepts Bitcoin due to climate impact

#107
post #75
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that you can't really take a company at face value if they reverse course after having already profited from their "lapse in judgement". The parent post lined out potential motivations behind all this that IMO aren't really that outlandish. It's speculation, but it's not some outlandish crackpot theory

Sure, but a basic rule of civility is that you should "assume good faith" and give others the benefit of the doubt when the good faith explanation is plausible.

In this case it isn't plausible as GP pointed out.

Re: Tesla no longer accepts Bitcoin due to climate impact

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When Tesla announced the initial move they received a huge amount of push back for the environmental concerns. And it didn’t look good for an EV company of all things. There is a trend I’ve seen of a company making a decison, everyone hating on them for it, then they reverse the decision, and they are still criticised. If a company turns around and reverses a decision citing the very reasons they were criticised for…

They could also spend half an hour to google bitcoin before buying them?

And they would eventually find https://Nano.org, a totally green, fast and fee-less alternative to Bitcoin. (Which has seen a price jump of 60% since the announcement).

Re: Tesla no longer accepts Bitcoin due to climate impact

#109
post #73
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. A very clever plan, executed to perfection. We don't know the price point of the BTC they bought at the time but it is likely to be somewhere around $30,000 - $40,000 and then they announced it to cause a run up close to $60,000 and then sold some of it for a >$101m profit. Now they somehow 'stop accepting Bitcoin' causing BTC to go down 12%. These same institutions are NOT interested in hodling. They are here t…

> while the retail investor hodls for their life savings at all time highs again. Said all this after the 2017/8 peak. Called people idiots for buying BTC at $20k. Laughed when it plummeted. Who's laughing now.

Hard to say - many were liquidated on the way down, may more sold in frustration. I'd suspect a ton of people lost a ton of money on the way down in 2017/8. They're not laughing.

Re: Tesla no longer accepts Bitcoin due to climate impact

#110

Why is is Bitcoin mining mainly happening in China, but not other compute bound tasks? How about machine learning. Why aren't the leading data centers for ML based in China? Or are they? And on the energy front - if fossil fuels are the best energy source for calculating hashes, why not for other types of number crunching? Can boycotting one type of calculations really keep the fossil fuels under the ground? If they…

Data centers mostly serve customers and customers care about reliability and latency.

Distance and Great Firewall of China do not help with any of that.

Also, because moving data to China is a legal nightmare in EU and public relations nightmare in the whole west.

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