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Uber used 50 Dutch shell companies to dodge taxes on $6B in revenue

businessinsider.com.au

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Re: Uber used 50 Dutch shell companies to dodge taxes on $6B in revenue

#41

Post by mrgordon »

anomaly_ wrote: post #29
imgabe wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's more fair to tax profits than revenues, we should be advocating for individuals to be treated in the more fair way, rather than advocating for corporations to be treated in the less fair way, don't you think? Besides, corporations generally have outside sources of funding other than income, while people generally don't. Thus corporations can run at a deficit, sometimes for a long time, while they figure out h…

Individuals are broadly taxed like companies in most western countries, it just turns out that most individuals don't actually incur many expenses in producing their income.

The vast majority of W-2 workers can't deduct unreimbursed employee expenses. So it’s not even that they don’t incur them, but rather that “employees” aren’t eligible

Re: Uber used 50 Dutch shell companies to dodge taxes on $6B in revenue

#42

Post by arsome »

tkubacki wrote: post #38

The only way to stop this, is to create income (eg. 1-2%) based tax regulations instead of profit based. No way to cheat.

Some industries are very low margin while others are extremely high, I don't think this is viable without breaking a huge chunk of the economy.

Re: Uber used 50 Dutch shell companies to dodge taxes on $6B in revenue

#44

Post by the_arun »

mycentstoo wrote: post #32

In my opinion, this is example of poor/incomplete regulation. Using sports as an analogy, it's like if a game was designed poorly, we have the expectation that players would act in good faith to not take advantage of rules. But players have the incentive to win, not act in good faith.

I wouldn't be surprised if there other big companies doing the same. So we need to fix the regulations to close this loophole.

Re: Uber used 50 Dutch shell companies to dodge taxes on $6B in revenue

#45

Post by beckman466 »

wdb wrote: post #40

I always feel a bit sad when I read my home country is used for these kind of things. Most of the time the companies still are depending on services of these countries to be able to be in business but don't pay their fair share.

> I always feel a bit sad when I read my home country is used for these kind of things.

Het is toch echt andersom. Nederland doet dit al jaren om in de ‘good graces’ van Amerika te zijn.

Are you surprised when you see this news?

Re: Uber used 50 Dutch shell companies to dodge taxes on $6B in revenue

#46

Post by Mediterraneo10 »

dkarras wrote: post #34
0goel0 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Individuals can't pretend to be based in Ireland to not pay US taxes. US taxes global individual income, but not global corporate profits.

>US taxes global individual income... Always wondered why US citizens do not make a bigger deal out of this. If I understand correctly, if you are a US citizen, but live somewhere else in the world, IRS still expects to be paid tax from your individual income in that foreign country (possibly in addition to the tax you pay in your country of residence) right? I assume there are minimum income thresholds but still...…

US citizens make something of a deal out of it, as you can see from expat forums every spring when tax-filing season comes. However, relatively few American citizens abroad choose to renounce their citizenship because they find it useful to retain it. The minimum income threshold to pay income taxes (otherwise you just file) is ~$100,000, so that generally means most middle-class people don’t have to pay.

The real pain is for people who don’t really think of themselves as US expats, but who have US citizenship through an accident of birth and perhaps haven’t thought of that in years. For them, it is when e.g. a bank in their country suddenly doesn’t want to accept them as a customer due to the onerous reporting requirements, that they are aghast at the situation.

> Are there even any other countries that do this?

Reportedly Eritrea.

Re: Uber used 50 Dutch shell companies to dodge taxes on $6B in revenue

#47

Post by manquer »

mycentstoo wrote: post #32

In my opinion, this is example of poor/incomplete regulation. Using sports as an analogy, it's like if a game was designed poorly, we have the expectation that players would act in good faith to not take advantage of rules. But players have the incentive to win, not act in good faith.

I don't think there any actual expectation by policy makers that there will be good faith. These rules are designed this way intentionally.

IMHO the consultants and lobbyists benefit from such convulted loopholes .

These setups are only possible for large consultants to deliver for large consultants and policy makers have plausible deniability when there is no obvious loopholes and benefit from lobbying perks , revoking doors, election donations if not outright corruption.

Re: Uber used 50 Dutch shell companies to dodge taxes on $6B in revenue

#48

Post by lmm »

agumonkey wrote: post #26
musicale wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has also managed to: - avoid taxi regulation and taxes by claiming it is not a taxi operator - avoid other taxes by claiming its employees are independent contractors

I hate to say this but I really wish harm on this company. Whatever hacker group decides to have fun with them will bring me great joy.

They should be held to account, but legitimately, legally. Their whole business model is based on crime. I don't understand why we don't see not only prosecution of their leaders, but RICO charges against their investors too.

Re: Uber used 50 Dutch shell companies to dodge taxes on $6B in revenue

#49

Post by beckman466 »

dkarras wrote: post #34
0goel0 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Individuals can't pretend to be based in Ireland to not pay US taxes. US taxes global individual income, but not global corporate profits.

>US taxes global individual income... Always wondered why US citizens do not make a bigger deal out of this. If I understand correctly, if you are a US citizen, but live somewhere else in the world, IRS still expects to be paid tax from your individual income in that foreign country (possibly in addition to the tax you pay in your country of residence) right? I assume there are minimum income thresholds but still...…

> if you are a US citizen, but live somewhere else in the world, IRS still expects to be paid tax from your individual income in that foreign country (possibly in addition to the tax you pay in your country of residence) right?

Does anyone know more about this? Do American pasport holders abroad pay taxes twice?

Re: Uber used 50 Dutch shell companies to dodge taxes on $6B in revenue

#50

Post by JoshTriplett »

dkarras wrote: post #34
0goel0 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Individuals can't pretend to be based in Ireland to not pay US taxes. US taxes global individual income, but not global corporate profits.

>US taxes global individual income... Always wondered why US citizens do not make a bigger deal out of this. If I understand correctly, if you are a US citizen, but live somewhere else in the world, IRS still expects to be paid tax from your individual income in that foreign country (possibly in addition to the tax you pay in your country of residence) right? I assume there are minimum income thresholds but still...…

> Always wondered why US citizens do not make a bigger deal out of this.

It affects a relatively small set of people (those with substantial income who live abroad in a lower-tax jurisdiction), and it'd be politically difficult to change.

> I assume there are minimum income thresholds but still...

None other than the normal thresholds for income taxes.

The one ameliorating factor is the foreign tax credit: you get a credit for taxes you've already paid to your local jurisdiction. So, in the likely case that you live somewhere with higher taxes, you won't pay any net US income tax. If you live somewhere with lower taxes, you'll pay the difference to the US.

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