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Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

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Re: Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

#51
post #3

There's this misconception that bitcoin is private / "safe" for criminals. In reality, the block chain is public (and all of its transactions inside... that is how distributed ledger consensus is achieved among miners) and the on-ramps and off-ramps between fiat are all logged / tracked, especially Coinbase (since they are taking the "safe route" and playing by all of the rules with governments / regulators). Your la…

Use Monero

Monero is not completely untraceable either.

Re: Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

#52
So Internet was demonized at first, saying it allowed pedophiles to share child pornography with impunity from their home. Then we learned that internet allowed to catch more pedophiles than ever.

Looks like this scheme finally applied to bitcoin. It was very easy to predict though.

Re: Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

#53

There's this misconception that bitcoin is private / "safe" for criminals. In reality, the block chain is public (and all of its transactions inside... that is how distributed ledger consensus is achieved among miners) and the on-ramps and off-ramps between fiat are all logged / tracked, especially Coinbase (since they are taking the "safe route" and playing by all of the rules with governments / regulators). Your la…

I agree, but think there's still ways to remain truly anonymous if you have the technical ability.

Why do you think ransomware groups always accept bitcoin?

Re: Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

#54
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. The Bitcoin Blockchain is a permanent historical ledger. As time passes and info about who transacted what becomes public, the cost of identifying a transaction decreases. (Assuming Bitcoin is still around) we should assume that over time, the cost to unmask any given btc txn to asymptotically approach $0. Even if you escape the statute of limitations, there is a good chance your grandchildren will be able to se…

> there is a good chance your grandchildren will be able to see what you did with Bitcoin by just looking it up on a public website in half a century. That's all of the internet, forget blockchains.

No, it isn't, if a service is properly secured and does not sell it's data then there is no reason to think this. Please stop spreading FUD like this, it only makes people think that privacy is impossible.

Even if you are talking about dragnet collection and you assume that for example NSA can store all traffic on the internet (which is basically impossible) in Utah (or wherever) for future decryption with post-quantum cryptography there is no reason to believe that they would make it public. And that is basically the worst case scenario.

Privacy fatalism helps no-one.

Re: Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

#55
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. The Bitcoin Blockchain is a permanent historical ledger. As time passes and info about who transacted what becomes public, the cost of identifying a transaction decreases. (Assuming Bitcoin is still around) we should assume that over time, the cost to unmask any given btc txn to asymptotically approach $0. Even if you escape the statute of limitations, there is a good chance your grandchildren will be able to se…

> there is a good chance your grandchildren will be able to see what you did with Bitcoin by just looking it up on a public website in half a century. That's all of the internet, forget blockchains.

Maybe my grandchildren will somehow have better luck than I did. Archive.org doesn't have several forums I used to post on. I'd like to get copies of my old posts, but gave up on that years ago. I did manage to track down the owner of one of the forums, but he had no backups.

"Everything stays on the internet forever" is a good cautionary principle, but isn't a strict reality.

Re: Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

#56
I am morbidly curious how much being a hit man pays. I don't want to look it up for fear of finding myself 'on a list' :) but it's such a high risk occupation that one assumes it's pretty profitable. In the US, anyway. This brings me to bitcoin.

Would it be smarter as a murderer-for-hire to ask to be paid in a less-expensive (for now) but growing currency such as Etherium or Litecoin? I mean, ask the 'client' for X dollars worth of that coin and then let it appreciate over time. Maybe that's missing the mark. But I sort of feel like you'd be better off going for the long term gains and, potentially at least, being able to cash out earlier?

Re: Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like it worked just great for one of the criminals... From TFA "The FBI has not, however, been able to identify the hitman as yet. The reason is almost certainly because the hitman did not use a commercial service like Coinbase, which must comply with know-your-customer laws, for the Bitcoin transactions but instead relied on his own personal wallet—one that did not reveal any information about his identity."

Unless the hitman has decided to retire, it's probably only a matter of time before they catch him using good old fashioned detective work. For instance, investigators might be able to catch the hitman in a sting operation, if they know what marketplace the hitman sells his services on.

I feel like you rather overestimate the prowess of law enforcements ability to solve murders, especially non-slam-dunk ones with a witness and an obvious connection between the murderer and victim.

Re: Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

#58

I am morbidly curious how much being a hit man pays. I don't want to look it up for fear of finding myself 'on a list' :) but it's such a high risk occupation that one assumes it's pretty profitable. In the US, anyway. This brings me to bitcoin. Would it be smarter as a murderer-for-hire to ask to be paid in a less-expensive (for now) but growing currency such as Etherium or Litecoin? I mean, ask the 'client' for X d…

Seems to go for less than $100K USD, which surprised me (source is Australian though http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/asiapcf/02/05/australia.ki...)

The Wikipedia page has more info on "contract killing", won't put you on a list to just read that :) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contract_killing

Since this murder-for-hire chose to use a global and transparent ledger that will have that transaction until either the world disappears or the ledger somehow disappears from all nodes, I don't think "smarter" should come anywhere near this. Using blockchains like Bitcoin for crime is far beyond stupid.

Re: Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

#59

I am morbidly curious how much being a hit man pays. I don't want to look it up for fear of finding myself 'on a list' :) but it's such a high risk occupation that one assumes it's pretty profitable. In the US, anyway. This brings me to bitcoin. Would it be smarter as a murderer-for-hire to ask to be paid in a less-expensive (for now) but growing currency such as Etherium or Litecoin? I mean, ask the 'client' for X d…

> Would it be smarter as a murderer-for-hire to ask to be paid in a less-expensive (for now) but growing currency such as Etherium or Litecoin?

No, because the efficient market hypothesis.

If you know that some asset is definitely going to significantly appreciate in value why don't you just buy it and skip out the hitman thing? The answer is that almost noone has any better idea of what the correct price should be than whatever the current price is.

Re: Man used Coinbase to pay hitman in Bitcoin for wife's murder, FBI says

#60
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, you have to look at the enormous number of ransomware operators that are conducting their business in fiat... Humm. I suppose that there aren't very many of them. Perhaps cryptocurrencies do make some forms of criminal enterprises much easier to operate. I'm willing to accept that 'Hitman for hire' might not be one of them, though - mostly because you need a local presence, at which point, taking payment…

People make it out like the fiat conversion step is a big gotcha but criminals make fraudulent bank accounts with stolen/synthetic identities all the time.

Then why are ransomware operators getting paid in Bitcoin?

It's not impossible to use the regular banking system for crime. But it's a lot harder, and a lot easier to get caught. A cartel in Mexico with an annual income in billions might be able to bribe or threaten the right people, but some techie running a small call center is going to have a harder time.

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