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Writing books is not really a good idea

ellegriffin.substack.com

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Re: Writing books is not really a good idea

#301

Post by nicolas_t »

sltkr wrote: post #149

> There are thousands of paid fiction authors on Patreon but only 25 earn more than $1,000/month, only six earn more than $2,000/month, and only one earns more than the $5,000/month (and she’s already a bestselling author). I think she missed a few authors in other categories. Examples: - https://www.patreon.com/Wildbow (over $6,000/month) - https://www.patreon.com/user?u=3814558 ($8,203 per chapter, roughly 1 chapte…

Yes, I was wondering where the author got those numbers, There's also https://www.patreon.com/senescentsoul who probably gets more than 5k a month since the minimum tier is $2.5/month

Re: Writing books is not really a good idea

#302

Post by KittenInABox »

NoOneNew wrote: post #290

I have one big issue with the book industry... many actually... but related to the article, all this whining is self imposed. Literary books are marketed far heavier than genre. This is the equivalent to arthouse films vs what actually makes money as a movie/show. Let's take one similar plot. A chemistry teacher is diagnosed with cancer, cant get treated and eventually dies. Literary and arthouse will do a discovery…

Every major publishing house has a SFF imprint with its own marketing budget and does marketing campaigns. Tor dot com (Macmillan), Orbit Books (Hachette), etc. They have marketing campaigns on youtube, tiktok, instagram, twitter and more. They have little video trailers, cover reveals, physical and collectible advance copies etc.

Or in simple words, could you clarify here?

Re: Writing books is not really a good idea

#303

Post by Ekaros »

ghaff wrote: post #240
snet0 wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but my assumption is that buying second-hand books gives no money to the author. I don't know, morally speaking if this should be the case. It does feel wrong for people to get the experience without paying the price of admission. Can this be solved logistically, though? And do publishers factor this into their RRP?

That same logic presumably applies to libraries. Books are physical objects at the end of the day just like a piece of pottery someone made. First sale doctrine explicitly allows the owner to lend or resell it to someone else.

Some countries solve this by paying the authors for each lend. Ofc, not nearly similar amount, but over long term it's not unreasonable.

Re: Writing books is not really a good idea

#304

Post by ellegriffin »

munificent wrote: post #220

> Not to mention, an author would have to come out with one book a year to maintain that salary. Your math looks odd to me. You look at the amount a book earns in a single year and extrapolate that to the author's annual salary , but seem to assume that once the first year is up, the book stops earning. Does books earning passive over multiple years affect the numbers? For what its worth, my single non-fiction book h…

Yes, I am basing that off the research I did for this article:

https://ellegriffin.substack.com/p/publishing-industry-truth

"Most books peak in the first 10 weeks after their debut, then exit the market."

This is "most" so of course there are exceptions. And it sounds like you are one of them. That is amazing! Did it have a big bump at front, and then decrease over time? Or have you seen other bumps later on?

I do wonder if serial content might be better. Because you get a bump every time you have a release, vs. only every three years when you have a whole book release.

Either way, I'm fairly certain that it's like you say, and that fiction will go the way of poetry and become to niche to make a living from it. But I'm going to at least give it a go and see what happens!

Re: Writing books is not really a good idea

#305

Post by narrator »

matsemann wrote: post #52
mxcrossb wrote: post #3

I wonder how serializing a novel would mesh with most author’s work flow. I guess most would want to write it first and release monthly an already finished product?

The Martian was released one chapter at the time. Same with Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality. As for the last one, it's felt that it was written as it was going along, with certain changes the author normally would have gone back to fix. Like stuff ending up not mattering, or certain inconsistencies in the world building. But even for larger book series this happens. Like Wheel of Time, one can in an earli…

The Martian is probably the best example of an author really embracing the 21st century. You give the text of the book away for free on a website and make money off the people who want the audiobook, the movie rights, the kindle, etc. In the 21st century, entertainment is free, attention is expensive, so you have to give away your free entertainment to get attention and then sell the entertainment in more rarified mediums like movies, audiobooks, even kindle, that require higher production costs than writing a blog.

Re: Writing books is not really a good idea

#306

Post by ellegriffin »

sltkr wrote: post #149

> There are thousands of paid fiction authors on Patreon but only 25 earn more than $1,000/month, only six earn more than $2,000/month, and only one earns more than the $5,000/month (and she’s already a bestselling author). I think she missed a few authors in other categories. Examples: - https://www.patreon.com/Wildbow (over $6,000/month) - https://www.patreon.com/user?u=3814558 ($8,203 per chapter, roughly 1 chapte…

These are great, thank you! They didn't show up in the fiction category, but makes sense since they are using other terminology. I'll definitely look into these as case studies!

Re: Writing books is not really a good idea

#307

Post by ellegriffin »

Aerroon wrote: post #277
sltkr wrote: post #149

> There are thousands of paid fiction authors on Patreon but only 25 earn more than $1,000/month, only six earn more than $2,000/month, and only one earns more than the $5,000/month (and she’s already a bestselling author). I think she missed a few authors in other categories. Examples: - https://www.patreon.com/Wildbow (over $6,000/month) - https://www.patreon.com/user?u=3814558 ($8,203 per chapter, roughly 1 chapte…

The author of The Legend of Randidly Ghosthound $5262/month: https://www.patreon.com/puddles4263 The author of Azarinth Healer has 3317 patrons at $2 minimum: https://www.patreon.com/RhaegarRRL Basically, you can look through RoyalRoad, Scribblehub, WebNovel, and various other places where quite a few people seem to find success. And that's not even mentioning the people who write novels and publish them on Amazon. >…

These are amazing! Thank you so much for sharing. I will look into these as case studies.

Re: Writing books is not really a good idea

#308

Post by jogjayr »

snet0 wrote: post #233
kpwagner wrote: post #99

In the month it will take me to finish reading Storm of Swords, I will watch ~10 movies. Plus, I'm reading Storm of Swords, which needs no additional support from readers to be discovered or validated--though I still want to read it. Plus, I digitally loaned it from my local library. I own a number of books (~200) and have probably owned x4 that total in my lifetime. Maybe 1/3 of those I paid full price for new. The…

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but my assumption is that buying second-hand books gives no money to the author. I don't know, morally speaking if this should be the case. It does feel wrong for people to get the experience without paying the price of admission. Can this be solved logistically, though? And do publishers factor this into their RRP?

Buying a house from a homeowner gives no money to the original builder, or the first human being to inhabit that piece of land. Do you feel guilty about getting shelter without paying the price of admission?

Re: Writing books is not really a good idea

#309

Post by mortenjorck »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #92

Some things at work here: 1. Leisure reading is at an all time low and declining [1]. I think reading books will go the way of live theater and classical music performances. It won't go away, but instead of a common, "every-man/woman" type of outing, it will be more niche/special occasion. I.e. whereas tons of people used to read often for pleasure in the early part of the 20th century, it is heading more towards a "…

The parallel to performing arts is the most plausible, yet optimistic counter I've seen to "people don't read books anymore." Fiction has its Harry Potters just as theater has its Wickeds, and Patreon is set to enable the closest literary equivalent to an urban live theater scene.

Re: Writing books is not really a good idea

#310

Post by NoOneNew »

KittenInABox wrote: post #302
NoOneNew wrote: post #290

I have one big issue with the book industry... many actually... but related to the article, all this whining is self imposed. Literary books are marketed far heavier than genre. This is the equivalent to arthouse films vs what actually makes money as a movie/show. Let's take one similar plot. A chemistry teacher is diagnosed with cancer, cant get treated and eventually dies. Literary and arthouse will do a discovery…

Every major publishing house has a SFF imprint with its own marketing budget and does marketing campaigns. Tor dot com (Macmillan), Orbit Books (Hachette), etc. They have marketing campaigns on youtube, tiktok, instagram, twitter and more. They have little video trailers, cover reveals, physical and collectible advance copies etc. Or in simple words, could you clarify here?

The average person who doesn't visit a bookstore has zero clue. If you're a reader, its all duh, but you're acting like an elitist then. Just because you know, doesn't mean outsiders know. At that, the "right books to read" attitude pisses me off. Its everywhere in some form or another in popular media where someone can accidentally see it.

The industry is constantly marketing to their diminishing demographic instead of trying to figure out how to increase it again.

Talk to non readers to find out their knowledge set of what kind of books are out there. Again, I convert folks all the time. I get zero a year readers to an average of 6 to 10 a year. Mostly because i used to hate reading until i got converted as well. I know the pain points.

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