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Analytics suggest 96% of users leave app tracking disabled in iOS 14.5

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Re: Analytics suggest 96% of users leave app tracking disabled in iOS 14.5

#211
post #127

What a surprise. If I tell people going to the store that they choose to pay for the products, or not, a lot of people will choose not to. Who would guess that people like free stuff? Apple is disrupting whole economy for apps. It’s a very broken economy, with lots of questionable practices, that’s for sure. But we’ll see if it’ll be net benefit for customers. For sure for Apple, as more apps will have to move to be…

At the end of the day, nothing is free. It's just a different payment scheme and Apple is killing that scheme. We don't even pay through our privacy or attention span. These are simply wasted in the process of offloading the payment to a different payment processor. The game is not free, it just collects the payments through the candy shop. The offsetting of the payment includes you stop playing and looking at candy…

> also Google's cut and Facebook's cut in advertisement(which is not transparent and I hear that it's about %50).

In general, neither Google nor FB take a "cut" in the traditional sense from their advertising. What (normally) happens is that advertiser bids their "true value" (i.e expected LTV), and a second price auction is run. In this kind of auction, the winner pays the price that the runner-up was willing to spend.

This differs massively from the pre-internet ad business (radio, tv, print etc), in that they would normally quote $X, but up to $X/10 was the minimum price, but the rest was built in as margin for people further up the chain (sales, agency etc).

One of the big problems that the ad agencies are having now is that their business model relied on arbitraging the price of the client vs the cost of the service, and this doesn't work for Google or Facebook.

That being said, both Goog and FB make insane amounts of money, but that's because the ads are essentially free to deliver (in fact, the users pay to render the ads themselves), and they have huge amounts of users to serve ads to.

Re: Analytics suggest 96% of users leave app tracking disabled in iOS 14.5

#212
post #156

What a surprise. If I tell people going to the store that they choose to pay for the products, or not, a lot of people will choose not to. Who would guess that people like free stuff? Apple is disrupting whole economy for apps. It’s a very broken economy, with lots of questionable practices, that’s for sure. But we’ll see if it’ll be net benefit for customers. For sure for Apple, as more apps will have to move to be…

>disrupting whole economy for apps Citation needed. Somehow there was an app economy before the rise of massive data aggregation. It's going to slightly impact the people profiting from the mass surveillance economy until they figure out how to get around it. This does nothing to impact the vast input feeds of location and traffic data from mobile carriers and ISPs, transaction data from purchases, etc. It basically…

It's probably gonna put a bunch of mobile game studios out of business. It was a tough business anyway, but the major advantage that they had was the ability to track at a device level and use that to be more efficient with their marketing spend.

More generally, it's gonna make FB and GOOG less useful for small, niche businesses. The big players will be fine, but lots of smaller businesses are likely to do less well.

Maybe the big players will do something to make cohorted ads work, but it will be less efficient and will lead to lots of small businesses having much more difficulty getting their products in front of the right people.

Re: Analytics suggest 96% of users leave app tracking disabled in iOS 14.5

#213
post #184
post #133

I'm curious about the 4% of users who enabled it. Did they get tricked into doing so? Was it an accident? Or do some people out there really genuinely want to be tracked?

I enable it on purpose. I like having more relevant ads, why would I want them to show me crappy untargeted ads instead?

What happened to the days when you could be asked about your interests and you would get ads based on that, rather than voyeuristically watching your every move to predict what your next fix will be?

Re: Analytics suggest 96% of users leave app tracking disabled in iOS 14.5

#214
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not accurate though, Apple can and does still track users. https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202074

Apple and ad companies are worlds apart.

Until they launch an ads service (which they are almost certainly going to do).

Re: Analytics suggest 96% of users leave app tracking disabled in iOS 14.5

#215
post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would it affect Google's stock? Google has Android, and is pretty upfront about the fact that they're collecting literally everything you do on your phone. Android still has the largest installed user base, and is still feeding tons of info to FB. FB's stock prices hasn't changed because we haven't seen if this really impacts revenue to FB. We know that banner ads are extremely ineffective. So if FB ads are still…

Not a huge fan of Google, but have to defend them here. They have a pretty huge privacy section in android settings where you can see exactly what data they have on you and how to opt out and/or delete existing data. When you set up android, it ask you if your want in or out. You can even set up a new android device without a Gmail account and disable all Google services including Gmail and search. I don't belive you…

iOS can also be set up without a Gmail account, no Google services required either.

Re: Analytics suggest 96% of users leave app tracking disabled in iOS 14.5

#216
post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a huge fan of Google, but have to defend them here. They have a pretty huge privacy section in android settings where you can see exactly what data they have on you and how to opt out and/or delete existing data. When you set up android, it ask you if your want in or out. You can even set up a new android device without a Gmail account and disable all Google services including Gmail and search. I don't belive you…

You can set up an iPhone without an Apple account.

That is mainly used to rescue a device, you can't really use it as your daily phone that way.

(Yes, I know there are some hacks to get around that )

Re: Analytics suggest 96% of users leave app tracking disabled in iOS 14.5

#217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> BTW, this is also why the covid exposure notification apps failed miserably. They should have always been opt-out. If Google or Apple remotely installed a hastily built tracker controlled by a government agency on my device I'd be pretty miffed about it.

Except it wasn’t hastily built, and the tracking isn’t controlled by a gov agency in the nefarious way that you’re implying.

I've seen all sorts of solutions put together by municipalities big and small from counties to states to countries and everything in between during this whole Covid thing and the thing that struck me is how easy it was for them to essentially track you with perfect precision and tie it back to a phone number.

> Except it wasn’t hastily built

They were built very hastily with little oversight with iterative beta cycles in plain sight.

> nefarious way that you’re implying

I didn't imply any nefarious intent what so over. All I implied is that your location data is being tracked and put into some database somewhere and you don't control it.

Who has this data? No idea. How will it be used a year from now? 10 years from now? No idea. Does it draw more energy on my device or use more processing power? No idea.

That alone is enough to not use it.

Re: Analytics suggest 96% of users leave app tracking disabled in iOS 14.5

#218

I've seen a lot of people confused by this, so I figured I'd clear it up: "App tracking" here means reading your device ID, called the 'Identity For Advertisers' (IDFA for short). They do this so that they can cross reference that IDFA with data that other apps have collected on that same IDFA, allowing them to connect the dots that it's the same user. This app tracking transparency feature makes it so that they can'…

>This is where the whole "I looked up nike shoes on Amazon and now I'm getting nike shoe ads on Facebook" comes from. Without the IDFA, Facebook has no way of knowing what you looked up on Amazon, only what you look up on Facebook.

Can this really be true? Wouldn't the conclusion be "Facebook can no longer rely on the IDFA for this information, but can probably gather it by a different ID shared between both Amazon and Facebook?"

Re: Analytics suggest 96% of users leave app tracking disabled in iOS 14.5

#219
4% is level with the Lizardman constant, i.e. the threshold of noise in the data:

https://slatestarcodex.com/2013/04/12/noisy-poll-results-and...

So that 4% is basically meaningless, indistinguishable from 0%, it might represent misunderstanding, misclicks and the like.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27076848

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