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Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

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Re: Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

#421

Post by hiddevb »

toper-centage wrote: post #344
danShumway wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a complicated topic, with multiple responses, but I'm only going to touch on one specific aspect of it. Reducing violence in regular farming is an admirable goal that people should strive towards. It's also worth talking about the environmental costs of ingredients like palm oil, and it's worth talking about the human costs of products like cocoa. I don't mean to diminish any of that at all, it's all worth pa…

There was a post of the front-page of reddit a few days ago saying that most Americans are lied to about the fish they are buying in restaurants and supermarkets. I think it hilarious when people like me, urban dwellers, tell me to my face they only buy meat from some small butcher because they only trust him, or some variation of that story. Truth is, we have no idea where our food comes from, labels lie, and seller…

There is a simple solution to this: buy it local. It might solve all issues with the meat (how do they feed these animals, etc.) but you at least know where it comes from.

I know it's not possible for everyone, but there is currently a big surge in local farm shops. I'm lucky enough to have a farming cooperative in my town where i can order weekly food from local farms and shops. I eat mostly vegetarian, but it's nice to have an option for some decent meat once in a while.

Re: Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

#422

Post by ur-whale »

sweetheart wrote: post #36

While it is not my experience at all, I understand that some folks have certain negative opinions of Beyond Burgers, and other fake meat/imitation burgers: - The texture is off - Maybe they cook strangely - Potentially less taste But the most important thing about them, and the reason I urge everyone to at least _try_ Beyond Burgers, is they require no violence against animals. This is not an argument that fairs well…

> No one needed to die for you to eat it.

I wonder what you make of carnivorous animals (cats, lions, tigers and the like)?

Should they also subscribe to your weird moral system?

Re: Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

#423

Post by knuthsat »

dev_tty01 wrote: post #381
atweiden wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I feel you. I stopped eating meat for 40 years for the same reason. But... they are on the same food chain we are, and they’d eat us in a heartbeat, right? Herbivorous ruminants like cows would never eat you, and would generally never harm you unless provoked. Breeding intelligent lifeforms in a bespoke way to murder them for cash — whatever the reason or creature involved — is diabolically evil. If you do this for…

I absolutely respect your choices and your opinion, but I don't understand them. Is the wolf diabolically evil? No cash involved of course. Is that the issue? What if I hunt the animal and kill it and then consume it, like the lion, the tiger, the hawk, and the dolphin? Is the hunter morally superior to the farmer who raises a steer, providing clean water, well grassed pasture, and then kills in a humane manner for p…

But killing is not humane if the individual does not want to die.

Humans give themselves incredible characteristics compared to other animals, it's like they are miles ahead of every animal when it comes to self awareness, emotion, rational thought, it's like evolution in their case made a giant leap and not an incremental step like it is for everyone.

Why are then humans comparing themselves to obligate carnivores like lions, tigers to justify their actions? Why are they looking at their natural bodies to justify the actions? How come when it comes to taking a life of another animal for sustenance, sustenance that can be achieved without the kill, they do not want to lift themselves up and draw a line between nature and themselves?

There are many things that come naturally yet we do not want to mimic that.

Re: Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

#424

Post by fogihujy »

imgabe wrote: post #257
sweetheart wrote: post #36

While it is not my experience at all, I understand that some folks have certain negative opinions of Beyond Burgers, and other fake meat/imitation burgers: - The texture is off - Maybe they cook strangely - Potentially less taste But the most important thing about them, and the reason I urge everyone to at least _try_ Beyond Burgers, is they require no violence against animals. This is not an argument that fairs well…

All living things die and are eaten by other living things. This isn’t wrong, it is the way nature works. Would you have every living thing just...stay alive forever? That’s not going to happen.

You have a valid point; killing an animal in order to eat it is not immoral, assuming you don't let anything go to waste. Factory farming, on the other hand, has nothing to do with how nature works. It's all about who raises the animals and how.

It' the same thing with the environmental aspect. If the animals graze all their lives then it might even have a positive effect on CO2 uptake in the long run, and it definitely is required for some biomes to survive. But, again, factory farming isn't exactly natural.

And yes, that applies to vegan food production as well.

Re: Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

#425

Post by King-Aaron »

fogihujy wrote: post #401
King-Aaron wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen a cow eating the carcass of another cow before. Kind of fascinating and morbid at the same time.

Why morbid? Even cute and fluffy little critters like rabbits will happily go specifically after flowers with bugs in them if given the chance. The circle of life is far more complicated than herbivores/carnivores and many animals will happily grab a meaty snack if opportunity arises.

Oh because it was in the middle of a drought, and it was pretty clear that the only reason that it was eating meat was due to a severe lacking of anything else to eat

Re: Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

#426

Post by ubercow13 »

atweiden wrote: post #365
jb_gericke wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been feeling more conflicted about consuming meat lately, but it's blanket assertions like this that trigger my inner libertarian hard, and I come out swinging. There is considerable evidence suggesting meat consumption contributed significantly to our cerebral expansion ( https://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/abs/10.1086/701477?mob... ). Unlike most great apes today, whose diet is primarily plant based, we can…

Human evolution is poorly understood, and the assumption that any choice $X supposedly made by early humans led to our forefathers’ anamolously rapid brain development is flatly speculative. > Unlike most great apes today, whose diet is primarily plant based, we can thank the incredible nutrient density in meat and our incredible hunting and tool creating ability for prefrontal cortex development. Complete and utter…

Raw soybeans are pretty toxic

Re: Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

#427

Post by [deleted] »

sweetheart wrote: post #36

While it is not my experience at all, I understand that some folks have certain negative opinions of Beyond Burgers, and other fake meat/imitation burgers: - The texture is off - Maybe they cook strangely - Potentially less taste But the most important thing about them, and the reason I urge everyone to at least _try_ Beyond Burgers, is they require no violence against animals. This is not an argument that fairs well…

[deleted]

Re: Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

#428

Post by [deleted] »

varajelle wrote: post #291
colordrops wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because we are natural meat eaters and still have strong cravings for meat even if we don't eat it. Eating a close facsimile can help those satisfy those cravings and avoid a rebound to eating real meat.

This "natural" argument does not make sense. You know what else is natural? Rape. Men are natural rapist, they like to have sex with any woman, if they have carving to do it, its all ok if they do it. ... Aren't we better than that?

[deleted]

Re: Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

#429

Post by fastball »

spicymaki wrote: post #311
fastball wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Land doesn't have to be used for anything, unless you want to do things. The point is that grazing is much less destructive to the original ecology than farming, so it's not clear that 1 acre of farming is better than 100 acres of grazing. I might be misguided here, but AFAIK grazing doesn't "deplete" the land at all (and might even improve the land with manure / etc), where as farming absolutely does unless you're c…

You can’t scale environmentally friendly organic grass fed beef. There is a reason why we have cruel factory farms.

Right, but I don't think anyone in this thread is arguing that Beyond Burgers don't scale better – people are merely pushing back against the idea that we should eliminate all consumption of meat and that all methods of raising such are objectively worse than such alternatives.

Re: Beyond Meat’s Beyond Burger life cycle assessment (2018)

#430

Post by colordrops »

varajelle wrote: post #291
colordrops wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because we are natural meat eaters and still have strong cravings for meat even if we don't eat it. Eating a close facsimile can help those satisfy those cravings and avoid a rebound to eating real meat.

This "natural" argument does not make sense. You know what else is natural? Rape. Men are natural rapist, they like to have sex with any woman, if they have carving to do it, its all ok if they do it. ... Aren't we better than that?

Yes we are better than that, and you are better than this at reading comprehension. Please re-read my post and recognize that my point is to avoid killing animals. Your analogy is absurd and the opposite of what I am saying.
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