Remembering that Napoleon reinstated slavery in France
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Re: Remembering that Napoleon reinstated slavery in France
#2Napoleon was a bloody dictator, he shouldn't be celebrated by someone supposed to represent the republic like Macron. Did he celebrate the first french republic in September?
No, because he is from/married into the old french bourgeoisie, that's who he represents and works for given his terrible record.
Re: Remembering that Napoleon reinstated slavery in France
#3Napoleon was a bloody dictator, he shouldn't be celebrated by someone supposed to represent the republic like Macron. Did he celebrate the first french republic in September? No, because he is from/married into the old french bourgeoisie, that's who he represents and works for given his terrible record.
The first French Republic was very much a bourgeois government so I’m not sure why his marriage would keep him from celebrating it.
Re: Remembering that Napoleon reinstated slavery in France
#4Napoleon was a bloody dictator, he shouldn't be celebrated by someone supposed to represent the republic like Macron. Did he celebrate the first french republic in September? No, because he is from/married into the old french bourgeoisie, that's who he represents and works for given his terrible record.
The first French Republic was very much a bourgeois government so I’m not sure why his marriage would keep him from celebrating it.
> The first French Republic was very much a bourgeois government so I’m not sure why his marriage would keep him from celebrating it.
The first republic is the foundation of the french state. What's next, Macron celebrating Louis the XVI?
Re: Remembering that Napoleon reinstated slavery in France
#5Probably a technicality but slavery was never authorized in mainland France. It was only in the colonies.
I know it didn't change anything for those who were enslaved, but it may also be good to remember that it was a time when all major powers used slaves, and France made a point of never allowing it in the actual country.
Re: Remembering that Napoleon reinstated slavery in France
#6Probably a technicality but slavery was never authorized in mainland France. It was only in the colonies. I know it didn't change anything for those who were enslaved, but it may also be good to remember that it was a time when all major powers used slaves, and France made a point of never allowing it in the actual country.
> it was a time when all major powers used slaves
This is really key here. There's a trend to hold people of the past up to standards of the present, but the world was extremely different then. Before the advent of farming machines and nitrogen fixation, labor dictated the power of a nation, labor relations and unions weren't a big thing, and a huge majority of the population worked in agriculture. Because there were no nuclear weapons capable of destroying the entire planet, superpowers commonly fought for resources, meaning the surviving nations had to be strong. The world is different.
Re: Remembering that Napoleon reinstated slavery in France
#7Napoleon was a bloody dictator, he shouldn't be celebrated by someone supposed to represent the republic like Macron. Did he celebrate the first french republic in September? No, because he is from/married into the old french bourgeoisie, that's who he represents and works for given his terrible record.
Reminder that "bourgeoisie" means "the middle class". Most of us here on HN are bourgeoisie or higher. There is nothing fundamentally wrong with being from the middle class.
There is nothing fundamentally wrong with government people being middle class either, in an ideal economy, bourgeoisie is the most common kind of citizen.
Re: Remembering that Napoleon reinstated slavery in France
#8Probably a technicality but slavery was never authorized in mainland France. It was only in the colonies. I know it didn't change anything for those who were enslaved, but it may also be good to remember that it was a time when all major powers used slaves, and France made a point of never allowing it in the actual country.
Did any of the European countries at the time allow slavery in their own borders? I don't think France is special in that regard.
Re: Remembering that Napoleon reinstated slavery in France
#9Napoleon was a bloody dictator, he shouldn't be celebrated by someone supposed to represent the republic like Macron. Did he celebrate the first french republic in September? No, because he is from/married into the old french bourgeoisie, that's who he represents and works for given his terrible record.
Reminder that "bourgeoisie" means "the middle class". Most of us here on HN are bourgeoisie or higher. There is nothing fundamentally wrong with being from the middle class. There is nothing fundamentally wrong with government people being middle class either, in an ideal economy, bourgeoisie is the most common kind of citizen.
The French overthrew and executed much of their upper class, so their middle class became the elite there, and that's why the term is used in that way. Compared to the UK where there is still an upper class.
Re: Remembering that Napoleon reinstated slavery in France
#10Probably a technicality but slavery was never authorized in mainland France. It was only in the colonies. I know it didn't change anything for those who were enslaved, but it may also be good to remember that it was a time when all major powers used slaves, and France made a point of never allowing it in the actual country.
> it was a time when all major powers used slaves This is really key here. There's a trend to hold people of the past up to standards of the present, but the world was extremely different then. Before the advent of farming machines and nitrogen fixation, labor dictated the power of a nation, labor relations and unions weren't a big thing, and a huge majority of the population worked in agriculture. Because there were…
Napoleon reinstated it in 1802 and it was abolished in 1848. There were only 46 years in between. The state bought the slaves and then freed them.
That is not a question of change within centuries, that is various people at that time making active decision to keep or abolish slavery.