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Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

bbc.com

221–230 of 311 posts

Re: Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

#221
post #141

Compounding USDA's lax practices has been its refusal to allow beef processors to independently test cattle for mad cow disease. In 2004, Creekstone Farms, a Kansas processor of black Angus beef with a large Japanese clientele, asked for permission to test its 300,000 cattle for BSE using a $500,000 testing site it had built to USDA specifications. But the agency ruled that the BSE test was licensed only for "surveil…

The risk of cow->human BSE transmission is infinitesimal. Species barriers in prions are surprisingly strong and, for practical purposes, nearly impermeable [0]. In fact, the Prion Protein (PrP) in humans causes multiple distinct diseases including CJD, Kuru, and FFI. Infectious prion confirmations are probably highly influenced by glycosylation [1,2]. Even if this testing wasn't god awfully slow, it's unclear one learns anything from it.

[0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2736662/ [1] https://www.cureffi.org/2013/05/05/prion-protein-n-linked-gl... [2] https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.02.14.431014v2

Re: Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

#222
post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering the history of the meat industry, I'm OK with not allowing the farms to police themselves.

That isn't what is happening. The USDA is prohibiting suplemental testing. The allegation is that this is because that might reveal cases of infection that would show the USDA testing policies are not sufficient. Thus the USDA is placing their reputation over the health of US citizens.

Another poster makes the argument that the USDA does not prohibit supplemental testing, it just prohibits making safety claims on the basis of supplemental testing.

I find their argument far more persuasive than yours. Is there more to yours?

Re: Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

#223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Prions cannot evolve, which is why they represent such a tiny space in diseases. They're really more a quirk of chemistry than biology.

They can’t evolve independently but biological systems that produce proteins can evolve new proteins and new ways of manipulating proteins. A nightmare scenario would be a bacterial or viral mutation that produced a deadly prion.

This feels like being worried about sharks evolving machine guns.

Re: Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

#224

In other Prion news, there's a prion disease, Chronic Wasting Disease (CWD), affecting populations of wild Deer, Elk, etc. in North America and other chunks of the world. It's not yet known to infect people, but please be careful when eating wild game. [1] My mind first went to this issue when I read the headline, though upon reading the article it's probably something else, as CWD isn't really a thing in that region…

The species barrier in prion transmission appear very strong [0]. Transmitting a prion from a hamster into a mouse often takes multiple passages of direct in brain inoculation. In these closely related species, perhaps it's less strong. It's doubtful that CWD can transmit to humans at typical exposure levels. In vitro, conversion of human PrP is possible, but exceedingly difficult.

[0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2736662/ [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5667731/

Re: Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

#225
post #141

Compounding USDA's lax practices has been its refusal to allow beef processors to independently test cattle for mad cow disease. In 2004, Creekstone Farms, a Kansas processor of black Angus beef with a large Japanese clientele, asked for permission to test its 300,000 cattle for BSE using a $500,000 testing site it had built to USDA specifications. But the agency ruled that the BSE test was licensed only for "surveil…

This is an incomplete description of the USDA's rationale. Although I agree that there shouldn't be a ban on private testing, the USDA's position is that BSE testing is ineffective at the time most cows are slaughtered, and would therefore provide an unwarranted impression of safety. > NOT A FOOD SAFETY TEST > BSE tests are not conducted on cuts of meat, but involve taking samples from the brain of a dead animal to s…

Thank you for the context!

Re: Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

#226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many countries would not allow people who lived in the UK during the 80s and 90s to give blood. I ate so many burgers back then too. Our kids after they were born weren't allowed beef for years.

Yep I'm one of them. Lived in the UK in the early 80's as a child. Gave blood for the first time when I was in college in the 90's to the Red Cross here in the US, and they mailed me back saying to never give blood again but didn't specify a reason. It wasn't until a few years later that I found out why. And the fact I might have a prion disease lurking in my blood sometimes terrifies me.

I don't think it's a concern any more. The trajectory of cases that should have occurred if CJD was widespread in the community, never happened. One consequence of this is the blood donation ban has been lifted in most countries, I think.

Re: Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

#227
post #221
post #141

Compounding USDA's lax practices has been its refusal to allow beef processors to independently test cattle for mad cow disease. In 2004, Creekstone Farms, a Kansas processor of black Angus beef with a large Japanese clientele, asked for permission to test its 300,000 cattle for BSE using a $500,000 testing site it had built to USDA specifications. But the agency ruled that the BSE test was licensed only for "surveil…

The risk of cow->human BSE transmission is infinitesimal. Species barriers in prions are surprisingly strong and, for practical purposes, nearly impermeable [0]. In fact, the Prion Protein (PrP) in humans causes multiple distinct diseases including CJD, Kuru, and FFI. Infectious prion confirmations are probably highly influenced by glycosylation [1,2]. Even if this testing wasn't god awfully slow, it's unclear one le…

>The risk of cow->human BSE transmission is infinitesimal.

I don't think your sources support this conclusion. bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE) rarely passes the species barrier, but it is difficult, if not impossible to estimate what the rate is in the absence of mitigations.

Re: Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

#228
post #141

Compounding USDA's lax practices has been its refusal to allow beef processors to independently test cattle for mad cow disease. In 2004, Creekstone Farms, a Kansas processor of black Angus beef with a large Japanese clientele, asked for permission to test its 300,000 cattle for BSE using a $500,000 testing site it had built to USDA specifications. But the agency ruled that the BSE test was licensed only for "surveil…

This is an incomplete description of the USDA's rationale. Although I agree that there shouldn't be a ban on private testing, the USDA's position is that BSE testing is ineffective at the time most cows are slaughtered, and would therefore provide an unwarranted impression of safety. > NOT A FOOD SAFETY TEST > BSE tests are not conducted on cuts of meat, but involve taking samples from the brain of a dead animal to s…

Sounds like a way to not test anything at all.

I really try to stay away from politics, but sounds as something made by some bribed political appointment.

Re: Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

#229

Since prions can be inhaled via aerosoles[1], I often wonder how long it will be until vaping causes prion diseases to rapidly spread. Or new prions to be introduced. [1]: https://journals.plos.org/plospathogens/article?id=10.1371/j...

Eh? Loads of bad stuff can be inhaled via aerosols so idk why you're mentioning prion diseases specifically. I mean not that long ago there was a lot of 'off the market' e-liquids that would cause popcorn lung.

Lots of aerosol "air fresheners" out there in operation too, that use petroleum gas as carriers. It's just accepted that it's fine to inhale petroleum gas.

Re: Doctors investigate mystery brain disease in Canada

#230
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The BBC were definitely covering it in late December 2019 - I distinctly remember the TV coverage on New Years Eve.

If you have any links to articles or news reports I would be very grateful.

Here is a western news report from mid November: https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/11/16/china-bubonic-plague-ou...
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