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How Basecamp Blew Up

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Re: How Basecamp Blew Up

#61

Post by ashtonkem »

eloff wrote: post #57
ashtonkem wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I think he’s lying here to cover his own ass. Especially if he’s been in the habit of quoting Breitbart, him pulling the “actually racism against whites is the real issue” is entirely believable.

That's not what he said though.

> I don't believe in a lot of the framing around implicit bias. I think a lot of this is actually racist.

So yes, the article does claim that he said this. Obviously he contests this, but it appears to be just his word alone against other people who were on the call. The balance of evidence does not appear to be on his side, here.

Re: How Basecamp Blew Up

#62

Post by tha0xa1 »

cozuya wrote: post #60
tha0xa1 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>On the other hand, when did racial equality become an inherently political topic? Especially racial equality inside the workplace. When acronyms became "white supremacy culture"[1], public magnet schools became "systemic racism"[2], showing up to work on time and objective thinking became "whiteness"[3], etc. "racial equality" became just another Motte and Bailey in the hyper-polarized toxic political world we live…

Its so, so rich to see criticism of "leftism" as "becoming a religion", when the right in this country literally worship a golden idol of The Former Guy at their politics conventions. "No one sane opposes racial equality, conservative or liberal." Hmm. Is the likes of Tucker Carlson "sane"? He and other mainstream right wing "thinkers" consistently put out viewpoints that oppose racial equality and oppose anti-racism…

>Its so, so rich to see criticism of "leftism" as "becoming a religion", when the right in this country literally worship a golden idol of The Former Guy at their politics conventions.

Whataboutism. No one is claiming otherwise, certainly not me. Indeed, the left is catching up to the right on interlacing religion and politics.

> Hmm. Is the likes of Tucker Carlson "sane"?

Not sure, probably not. I honestly do not watch Fox News.

> He and other mainstream right wing "thinkers" consistently put out viewpoints that oppose racial equality and oppose anti-racism.

Links to racist viewpoints he's put out?

>Are you an anti-racist?

Please define "anti-racist".

Re: How Basecamp Blew Up

#63

Post by cozuya »

tha0xa1 wrote: post #62
cozuya wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its so, so rich to see criticism of "leftism" as "becoming a religion", when the right in this country literally worship a golden idol of The Former Guy at their politics conventions. "No one sane opposes racial equality, conservative or liberal." Hmm. Is the likes of Tucker Carlson "sane"? He and other mainstream right wing "thinkers" consistently put out viewpoints that oppose racial equality and oppose anti-racism…

>Its so, so rich to see criticism of "leftism" as "becoming a religion", when the right in this country literally worship a golden idol of The Former Guy at their politics conventions. Whataboutism. No one is claiming otherwise, certainly not me. Indeed, the left is catching up to the right on interlacing religion and politics. > Hmm. Is the likes of Tucker Carlson "sane"? Not sure, probably not. I honestly do not wa…

Carlson routinely trots out "great replacement" white supremacy talking points.

https://apnews.com/article/race-and-ethnicity-tucker-carlson...

Carlson says immigrants make America 'Poorer' and 'Dirtier' (hint: not immigrants from Norway)

https://www.newsweek.com/fox-news-tucker-carlson-migrants-di...

Carlson is one of the most popular right wing commentators in the country. His show is one of the most watched on TV. He is routinely in the top ten polled of GOP candidates for President in 2024.

You say: "No one sane opposes racial equality, conservative or liberal." You might be right, but only because there are no sane conservatives not named Mitt Romney or Liz Cheney and I think they have better things to do than hang out on HN.

Re: How Basecamp Blew Up

#64

Post by tha0xa1 »

cozuya wrote: post #63
tha0xa1 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Its so, so rich to see criticism of "leftism" as "becoming a religion", when the right in this country literally worship a golden idol of The Former Guy at their politics conventions. Whataboutism. No one is claiming otherwise, certainly not me. Indeed, the left is catching up to the right on interlacing religion and politics. > Hmm. Is the likes of Tucker Carlson "sane"? Not sure, probably not. I honestly do not wa…

Carlson routinely trots out "great replacement" white supremacy talking points. https://apnews.com/article/race-and-ethnicity-tucker-carlson... Carlson says immigrants make America 'Poorer' and 'Dirtier' (hint: not immigrants from Norway) https://www.newsweek.com/fox-news-tucker-carlson-migrants-di... Carlson is one of the most popular right wing commentators in the country. His show is one of the most watched on TV.…

You're strawmaning here because we agree that Carlson isn't "sane".

Some of your links take things he's said way out of context ("dirty" was referencing the amount of garbage left by illegal immigration at the border, an objective fact), and he's not wrong about leftists wanting to remove borders and import as many people into the West as possible, including an actual Democratic presidential candidate [1].

>(hint: not immigrants from Norway)

They're not flooding in illegally by the tens of thousands every month.

You say: "No one sane opposes racial equality, conservative or liberal." You might be right, but only because there are no sane liberals not named Barak Obama or Joe Lieberman and I think they have better things to do than hang out on HN.

You're still strawmaning and partaking in whataboutism here.

[1] https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2019/07/are-democrats...

Re: How Basecamp Blew Up

#65

Post by [deleted] »

fallenfromgrace wrote: post #29
eloff wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like what?

I was struck quite a bit by “I don't believe in a lot of the framing around implicit bias. I think a lot of this is actually racist.” The context it was said in made the statement rather jarring. I am all for their initial stance of "no politics" etc, but their all-hands was a face palm all around.

[deleted]

Re: How Basecamp Blew Up

#66

Post by cozuya »

tha0xa1 wrote: post #64
cozuya wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Carlson routinely trots out "great replacement" white supremacy talking points. https://apnews.com/article/race-and-ethnicity-tucker-carlson... Carlson says immigrants make America 'Poorer' and 'Dirtier' (hint: not immigrants from Norway) https://www.newsweek.com/fox-news-tucker-carlson-migrants-di... Carlson is one of the most popular right wing commentators in the country. His show is one of the most watched on TV.…

You're strawmaning here because we agree that Carlson isn't "sane". Some of your links take things he's said way out of context ("dirty" was referencing the amount of garbage left by illegal immigration at the border, an objective fact), and he's not wrong about leftists wanting to remove borders and import as many people into the West as possible, including an actual Democratic presidential candidate [1]. >(hint: no…

What is the strawman? What is the whataboutism? I'm talking directly about your statement:

"No one sane opposes racial equality, conservative or liberal."

Tucker Carlson, one of the most popular "conservatives", opposes racial equality and promotes white supremacy. You can call him "not sane" if you want, but he has millions of viewers every day and his views are absolutely mainstream Republicanism in 2021. There are zero Republican voters or public figures who disagree with Carlson or condemn him.

So which is it, are almost all Republicans actually "insane", or are almost all Republicans against racial equality?

Re: How Basecamp Blew Up

#67

Post by chris11 »

ashtonkem wrote: post #49
tomschlick wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Singer clarifies in the later follow up to say he was referring to the people at Basecamp, not in reference to the whole country. > To which Singer responded: “I said we have different ways of framing … If you want to debate whether it exists anywhere, then yeah. But not here at this company, not with the people I associate with.” Edit: to add quote

Sorry, I think he’s lying here to cover his own ass. Especially if he’s been in the habit of quoting Breitbart, him pulling the “actually racism against whites is the real issue” is entirely believable.

The article asked Singer for a comment, and printed his full reply.

> I objected to an employee’s statement that we live in a white supremacist culture. White supremacism exists, and America’s history of racism still presents terrible problems, but I don’t agree that we should label our entire culture with this ideology.

His reply was focused on white supremacy in America, he didn't mention a misunderstanding about referring to just the company. There's that other quote from him, but it's strange his entire reply focused on the country if he was just referring to Basecamp.

Re: How Basecamp Blew Up

#68

Post by SvenMarquardt »

rodgerd wrote: post #22
DiNovi wrote: post #6

so they: - Announced a new company policy publicly before telling the staff - Deleted internal threads that would go against their narrative of why they did so - Had a conservative senior employee go off about politics on the call discussing the new no politics policy. - refused to reprimand said employee on the call - had one founder take this extremely sensitive call from his bed with his camera off and on mute. -…

> - Had a conservative senior employee go off about politics on the call discussing the new no politics policy. Ironically it seems that, contra to the narrative existing in the minds of quite a few HN posters, it was the Brietbart quoting, "white people are the real victims of racism" guy who had spend over a decade being unable to shut up about politics in the workplace.

Where's your evidence of that?

Re: How Basecamp Blew Up

#69

Post by tha0xa1 »

cozuya wrote: post #66
tha0xa1 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're strawmaning here because we agree that Carlson isn't "sane". Some of your links take things he's said way out of context ("dirty" was referencing the amount of garbage left by illegal immigration at the border, an objective fact), and he's not wrong about leftists wanting to remove borders and import as many people into the West as possible, including an actual Democratic presidential candidate [1]. >(hint: no…

What is the strawman? What is the whataboutism? I'm talking directly about your statement: "No one sane opposes racial equality, conservative or liberal." Tucker Carlson, one of the most popular "conservatives", opposes racial equality and promotes white supremacy. You can call him "not sane" if you want, but he has millions of viewers every day and his views are absolutely mainstream Republicanism in 2021. There are…

>What is the strawman?

"No one sane", and then you build the Tucker Carlson strawman, and continue to use him, after we both conclude he's not "sane".

> What is the whataboutism?

Bringing up right-wing examples here when they were immaterial to my OP.

These are textbook examples of strawmaning and whatabouting.

>Tucker Carlson, one of the most popular "conservatives", opposes racial equality

Where did he oppose racial equality? I did not see any of that in the links you provided. Can you link actual Tucker Carlson videos of him making statements that oppose racial equality?

>You can call him "not sane" if you want, but he has millions of viewers every day and his views are absolutely mainstream Republicanism in 2021.

ChapTrapHouse, TYT, etc. has millions of subscribers that listen every day and their views are absolutely mainstream Democratism in 2021. There are zero Democratic voters or public figured who disagree with CTH/TYT or condemn him

So which is it, are almost all Democrats actually "insane", or are almost all Democrats against racial equality (anti-White, and becoming more anti-Asian)?

You're strawmaning here again because you haven't provided anything that shows Tucker Carlson, or the Republican Party platform, is against racial equality.

Nonetheless, it's all whataboutism. You're incapable of refuting any of my points, including my OP, so you're commiting several fallacies here.

Re: How Basecamp Blew Up

#70

Post by davidgerard »

SvenMarquardt wrote: post #68
rodgerd wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - Had a conservative senior employee go off about politics on the call discussing the new no politics policy. Ironically it seems that, contra to the narrative existing in the minds of quite a few HN posters, it was the Brietbart quoting, "white people are the real victims of racism" guy who had spend over a decade being unable to shut up about politics in the workplace.

Where's your evidence of that?

at the top, you'll see a link to the article this thread is about
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