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Why are there so many unfinished buildings in Africa?

economist.com

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Re: Why are there so many unfinished buildings in Africa?

#121

Post by herodoturtle »

baybal2 wrote: post #111
herodoturtle wrote: post #33

> What is going on? Start with the lack of finance. Many Senegalese developers struggle to obtain loans without hefty collateral. Instead, some start building, hoping to tempt buyers to put down deposits on flats and then use that to help finance the rest of the building. But buyers are wary of making a commitment based on a construction site. These unfinished projects often tie up prime land, too. > For Senegalese h…

That's vastly inaccurate. Unless they talk about some really poor Central African countries, it's not a problem in more well off parts of coastal Africa. A Kenyan, or Nigerian family of economically active class can buy their first property in cash. The talk here is a about the part of populace who is just above living in slums, and informal housing. A very different matter without a doubt.

> That's vastly inaccurate.

Which part of the article (or my comment), exactly, is vastly inaccurate?

Having lived in an affluent part of coastal Africa for a couple of decades, I am intimately familiar with the wealth disparity which you speak of.

But I don't see how the luxurious living of the minority renders the overall arguments in that article inaccurate.

Please help me understand what you're referring to?

Re: Why are there so many unfinished buildings in Africa?

#122

Post by globular-toast »

mikro2nd wrote: post #114
globular-toast wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like they have in South Africa? That's going well...

Not sure what you're referring to, since South Africa has had a well-ordered and fully functional cadastre for well over a century (to my knowledge, probably quite a lot longer).

Yeah, it's also had money for at least that long too. I was referring to it having one of the highest crime rates in the world and the highest inequality coefficient by a considerable margin.

Re: Why are there so many unfinished buildings in Africa?

#123

Post by zappo2938 »

Accujack wrote: post #115
baybal2 wrote: post #107

> The lack of liquidity in the financial system then further limits what banks can lend to builders. The massive credit expansion is exactly what you don't want if you want to ease the housing market. The Economist got almost everything in this story wrong. I have personal experience of being to Nigeria a few times on infrastructure subcontract projects. The predominant portion of those abandoned construction sites a…

>Africa needs more factories, more mills, more kilns, more technical know how. Also less exploitation by industrialized nations and more leaders who want to improve their country's infrastructure rather than just get into a position of power so they can be a rich king. Western nations will invest in Africa if it gets them something... minerals, oil, other resources. They don't invest in Africa's people, they invest i…

> exploitation by industrialized nations

We hear a lot about how China invests billions in Africa building highways and such in order to have influence. I have a conspiracy theory based on stories I heard. It would be nice to know if is true or not. What Americans don't realize is that the Gambino crime family didn't just dissolve, they went to Africa, and they bought rights to natural resources such as coal. They have since the early 2000s become the brokers between natural resources in Africa and 3rd party buyers around the world and their business is violence.

Re: Why are there so many unfinished buildings in Africa?

#124

Post by baybal2 »

herodoturtle wrote: post #121
baybal2 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's vastly inaccurate. Unless they talk about some really poor Central African countries, it's not a problem in more well off parts of coastal Africa. A Kenyan, or Nigerian family of economically active class can buy their first property in cash. The talk here is a about the part of populace who is just above living in slums, and informal housing. A very different matter without a doubt.

> That's vastly inaccurate. Which part of the article (or my comment), exactly, is vastly inaccurate? Having lived in an affluent part of coastal Africa for a couple of decades, I am intimately familiar with the wealth disparity which you speak of. But I don't see how the luxurious living of the minority renders the overall arguments in that article inaccurate. Please help me understand what you're referring to?

I am referring to them singling out that "liquidity" thing as the sole culprit, while much more obvious problem of omnipresent "fraudstrepreneurs," and cost of construction materials outside of tier 1 economies of Africa is not even mentioned.

Saying simply, credit availability make little difference for construction business in already relatively well doing countries in Africa, and everybody else will have much more obvious issues to deal with first.

Re: Why are there so many unfinished buildings in Africa?

#125

Post by bellyfullofbac »

hnbad wrote: post #66
bellyfullofbac wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like an urban legend. If the local people want the building, why not guide the helpers so they have a proper building from the start, rather than waste their own time building something shoddy, tearing it down, and building it again? My Western viewpoint also thinks there isn't much "spec" that poorer countries follow, maybe just: if it looks like it won't collapse, it's good enough, and hopefully young people…

The college kids are paying money for food and lodging. They're basically paying for an adventure and a cozy feeling and they get that. People in poor countries don't need scrawny wealthy college kids to help them build mud huts that are "good enough" as long as they look like they won't collapse. Not to mention that most of those kids probably have no prior experience building anything by hand or the physical streng…

Deluded HN commenter (or HN hater, with your nickname) thinks people in poor/developing countries would make such elaborate scams.

As I've replied upthread, the kids could just be told to carry bricks and wooden planks (and hammer some nails in - it's not rocket science) and they'd probably feel glad they contributed.

If I wanted to scam some Western kids, I'd just start a construction company, get them to volunteer, and tell them we're building an orphanage, while pocketing the profits for the office building being constructed. Not tell them to make something and then tear it back down when they've left.

Re: Why are there so many unfinished buildings in Africa?

#127

Post by ArkanExplorer »

herodoturtle wrote: post #33

> What is going on? Start with the lack of finance. Many Senegalese developers struggle to obtain loans without hefty collateral. Instead, some start building, hoping to tempt buyers to put down deposits on flats and then use that to help finance the rest of the building. But buyers are wary of making a commitment based on a construction site. These unfinished projects often tie up prime land, too. > For Senegalese h…

The population of Senegal is 13 million, with only 50,000 Europeans:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senegal#Ethnic_groups

Or 99.6% African.

The Top 40 countries by HDI are all European or East Asian (excluding those with oil):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Dev...

Why don't countries like Senegal seek to increase their European and East Asian populations until development targets are met? They could offer tax-free immigration and residency.

Re: Why are there so many unfinished buildings in Africa?

#128

Post by loonster »

bluecalm wrote: post #53
Gibbon1 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Years ago I read the same about places in the US as well. And of assessors being really intrusive. People being butthurt because they feel they are being punished for keeping their house up. I've heard California used to base assessments on comparative values so that people don't try and game the system with crummy substandard construction and materials.

Well it's natural that people feel it's unfair to tax them more just because they make their house nicer. It's just a very unfair tax. Think about it. You spend money and work a lot of hours to refurbish your kitchen and then you're informed you have to pay more because of it. I am surprised people don't rebel against this policy.

Another reason to avoid getting permits for remodels.

Re: Why are there so many unfinished buildings in Africa?

#130

Post by pvaldes »

ricardobayes wrote: post #61
rudyfink wrote: post #6

I have no idea if it is true, but, in Egypt, my guide (who I will say was wonderfully knowledgeable on historic matters), stated that the reason many properties had rebar extending upwards (e.g., it looked like there were more stories to be added) was related to tax policy. I forget the full detail of her explanation, but there was some different kind of tax treatment if the building was "finished," so there were a n…

Same in Spain. Paperwork surrounding a newly build house costs a lot, up to 25% of the whole project, so in many instances people decide to build illegally. Nobody touches them as it would be a massive political uproar if any ruling political party tried to clean the situation up. Also, if no neighbors 'denounce' an illegal building, it becomes legal after 4 years or so.

Hem, not... this is not how it works in Spain. Maybe a local exception, but not the rule. The law is very clear about it.
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