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My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

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Re: My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

#41

Post by scpedicini »

rasputnik6502 wrote: post #6

Nice story. It takes some experience and self knowledge to identify what is a joke and what is bullying. Most men just want to be liked, seem witty and funny, and sometimes are just going a too far to show off. But there's a group of people who will belittle you to humiliate and assert their higher position in the hierarchy and this is a part of an ugly campaign to destroy any competition (which also means you're per…

I mean... this sounds like the exact job that "git blame" is made for. Does your company not have some kind of version control?

Re: My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

#42

Post by wjertyj »

mc32 wrote: post #40
altano wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would have guessed that the person who greeted me, showed me where to sit, and asked if I needed anything before leaving was a receptionist regardless of gender. That seems like an unfair strike/test. I had the exact same thought and then immediately realized it was bullshit. If it was a man I think I would question their role and I think that’s true of most people. It’s hard to say after the fact. Some people do…

It doesn’t matter. Orgs should not play stupid games with candidates like this. Might as well have someone pretend they are having a seizure and see how they react and base hiring on their reaction.

What is the stupid game, exactly? Filtering if the candidate is an asshat towards women?

Re: My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

#43

Post by scpedicini »

I'm not trying to invalidate this woman's experiences, because if they are genuinely true as written down, then that is some seriously toxic misogynistic shit, but some of the quotes from the male interviewees sound like they could be lifted straight out of an episode of mad men and an office in the 1960s.

“Hey, hon, before you go… can you get me some more coffee? And put some sugar in it."

I mean... really?? It's hard for me to even imagine those words coming out of a white-collar software engineer applicant. Did they hoot and wolf whistle as she walked by too?

I can only speak anecdotally but as a software engineer for the last two decades I've never seen anything even remotely like this in any of the software companies that I worked at, while bearing in mind that of course as a male I would likely be less likely to notice.

There is likely some truth in this article but it feels like it might be mixed up with some exaggerations which to me hurt the message as a whole.

Re: My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

#44

Post by mc32 »

wjertyj wrote: post #42
mc32 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn’t matter. Orgs should not play stupid games with candidates like this. Might as well have someone pretend they are having a seizure and see how they react and base hiring on their reaction.

What is the stupid game, exactly? Filtering if the candidate is an asshat towards women?

Not having a schedule with the people candidates are supposed to speak with which includes their titles/roles and not introducing yourself to the candidate. Then complain if a candidates makes the wrong assumptions about people’s roles and ignore the right assumptions candidates make when meeting and greeting strangers.

When cops do this it’s entrapment but when a hiring manager does it... it’s good. I guess the police should go out and entrap as many people as they can I’m sure they’ll find a few criminals among the population.

Why not have the CEO role play a custodian with a mop and flip out when candidates make assumptions?

Re: My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

#45

Post by bjourne »

scpedicini wrote: post #43

I'm not trying to invalidate this woman's experiences, because if they are genuinely true as written down, then that is some seriously toxic misogynistic shit, but some of the quotes from the male interviewees sound like they could be lifted straight out of an episode of mad men and an office in the 1960s. “Hey, hon, before you go… can you get me some more coffee? And put some sugar in it." I mean... really?? It's ha…

One time me and a female colleague needed to have one of the salespeople sign a form and he blurted out to her: "Maybe you want my digits too, wink, wink!" So yeah, I do believe her.

Re: My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

#46

Post by rcxdude »

etrabroline wrote: post #14
thedevelopnik wrote: post #2

How did Dick not get fired long before if everyone thought he was terrible? Oh right, that company did not learn the lesson of the first one, coding is not as important as being a decent person when it comes to building a team.

I will never understand this logic. It doesn't matter how friendly someone is if they can't code, but even if someone is difficult to work with (as many smart computer programmers are) they can still be hugely important to a team's success. Obviously there are limits to both of these, but technical ability is the requirement and "being fun to work with" is the nice-to-have. I think highly socialized people tend to co…

A highly technically skilled but anti-social team member can easily have negative productivity as they bring down (or drive out) everyone else in the team. This doesn't even require them to be an asshole: just being bad at communicating can do it (I have had such a coworker: nice, very technically skilled, completely useless as part of a team).

Re: My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

#47

Post by bjourne »

rasputnik6502 wrote: post #6

Nice story. It takes some experience and self knowledge to identify what is a joke and what is bullying. Most men just want to be liked, seem witty and funny, and sometimes are just going a too far to show off. But there's a group of people who will belittle you to humiliate and assert their higher position in the hierarchy and this is a part of an ugly campaign to destroy any competition (which also means you're per…

I don't get how the dev's gender factors into the story. Everyone of us have dealt with colleagues that don't handle criticism well and/or are poor performers. That your conclusion is that it is because she is a woman (don't call them girls) may indicate that you have some learning to do.

Re: My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

#48

Post by spicymaki »

This will sound pretty weird, but this person reminds me of a interesting character in the anime "Great Teacher Onizuka." The chairwoman (Ryoko Sakurai) of the prestigious academy (where the show takes place) would work in disguise at the school canteen in order get a real feeling for how people really were. If they new her true power they might treat her with insincere deference.

I thought the idea was ingenious, and I am glad to see that people are actually employing that strategy in real life.

https://great-teacher-onizuka-gto.fandom.com/wiki/Ryoko_Saku...

Re: My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

#49

Post by M2Ys4U »

scpedicini wrote: post #43

I'm not trying to invalidate this woman's experiences, because if they are genuinely true as written down, then that is some seriously toxic misogynistic shit, but some of the quotes from the male interviewees sound like they could be lifted straight out of an episode of mad men and an office in the 1960s. “Hey, hon, before you go… can you get me some more coffee? And put some sugar in it." I mean... really?? It's ha…

"I'm not trying to invalidate this woman's experiences, but "

Re: My life as a woman in tech, told in three beverages

#50

Post by wjertyj »

mc32 wrote: post #44
wjertyj wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the stupid game, exactly? Filtering if the candidate is an asshat towards women?

Not having a schedule with the people candidates are supposed to speak with which includes their titles/roles and not introducing yourself to the candidate. Then complain if a candidates makes the wrong assumptions about people’s roles and ignore the right assumptions candidates make when meeting and greeting strangers. When cops do this it’s entrapment but when a hiring manager does it... it’s good. I guess the poli…

In 15 years of interviewing (both sides of the table) at FAANGs, universities, startups, hedge funds, and the us federal government, I can think of exactly one time I was given an itinerary outlining who I'd speak with, and zero when one of my candidates was provided with one.

No, when cops do what's described, it's called an undercover assignment. Entrapment is when the police encourage the forbidden behavior. In no way shape nor form is having a woman greet you coming near entrapment.

As for having a CEO play custodian, sure, it's a poor use of my time in leadership, but at the end of the day, I don't care who is carrying a mop around the office. I do care about keeping out the shitheads who feel they're entitled to disrespect someone because they're carrying a mop.

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