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SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Impairs Endothelial Function via Downregulation of ACE2

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Re: SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Impairs Endothelial Function via Downregulation of ACE2

#11

Post by Alex3917 »

ronri19 wrote: post #8
TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The spike protein from the virus bands to ACE2 receptor, messing them up. The vaccine primes our bodies to attack the spike protein, preventing it from binding to ACE2 and thus preventing it from messing up ACE2 receptors.

But the vaccine causes the body to produce spike protein. The CDC emphasizes the spike protein is harmless, but this new research finds that the spike protein itself can cause damage. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different...

> this new research finds that the spike protein itself can cause damage.

Downregulation of ACE-2 causes damage, not the spike protein. The spike protein itself causes downregulation, but not enough to cause damage.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Impairs Endothelial Function via Downregulation of ACE2

#12

Post by ronri19 »

gameswithgo wrote: post #10
ronri19 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But the vaccine causes the body to produce spike protein. The CDC emphasizes the spike protein is harmless, but this new research finds that the spike protein itself can cause damage. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different...

This has been the clever guy hot take for a few days now. Yet millions of people are walking around vaccinated without damage, so....

We also have 150+ million people around the world who've had the virus walking around without damage.

The point is how should we change our recommendations? Are older people or others with certain medical conditions more susceptible to damage?

I don't see how shrugging off this new information is reasonable or scientific.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Impairs Endothelial Function via Downregulation of ACE2

#13

Post by retrac »

ronri19 wrote: post #8
TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The spike protein from the virus bands to ACE2 receptor, messing them up. The vaccine primes our bodies to attack the spike protein, preventing it from binding to ACE2 and thus preventing it from messing up ACE2 receptors.

But the vaccine causes the body to produce spike protein. The CDC emphasizes the spike protein is harmless, but this new research finds that the spike protein itself can cause damage. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different...

It causes the body to produce it in a limited, fixed quantity in proportion to the number of viable RNA strands that make it into a cell, largely localized at the injection site. Just a guess but this probably means its risk is extremely limited.

The wild virus causes this protein to be produced without check.

It wouldn't just be the mRNA vaccines, anyway. The viral vector ones, as well as the inactivated virus, and the spike protein unit extract ones, all involve getting some of the spike protein either made in the cells, or introduce it directly.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Impairs Endothelial Function via Downregulation of ACE2

#14

Post by tediousdemise »

gameswithgo wrote: post #10
ronri19 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But the vaccine causes the body to produce spike protein. The CDC emphasizes the spike protein is harmless, but this new research finds that the spike protein itself can cause damage. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different...

This has been the clever guy hot take for a few days now. Yet millions of people are walking around vaccinated without damage, so....

Or walking around damaged, and they don’t know it yet.

Didn’t it take us thousands of years to realize lead was poisonous?

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Impairs Endothelial Function via Downregulation of ACE2

#15

Post by fnordpiglet »

ronri19 wrote: post #8
TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The spike protein from the virus bands to ACE2 receptor, messing them up. The vaccine primes our bodies to attack the spike protein, preventing it from binding to ACE2 and thus preventing it from messing up ACE2 receptors.

But the vaccine causes the body to produce spike protein. The CDC emphasizes the spike protein is harmless, but this new research finds that the spike protein itself can cause damage. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different...

The vaccine instructs cells to produce a piece of protein from the spike. There’s no such thing as “a” spike protein, the spike is a structure of proteins that enable a lot of functions for the virus. They choose a piece of protein from the structure that’s antigenic then encode the mRNA to produce that. The mRNA is delivered into the cell by the lipid transport and the cell picks up the instruction and produces the antigenic protein fragment. Your immune system responds as expected and attacks the antigen carrying things - existing cells included. The inoculated mRNA is quickly broken down because mRNA is a standard process in cell function.

Unless the effect observed is due to the antigen the vaccine produces then you wouldn’t expect to see the same behavior in vaccinated humans as they saw experimentally with a full virus, even if some part or the full assembly of the spike is a cause for cellular damage.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Impairs Endothelial Function via Downregulation of ACE2

#16

Post by [deleted] »

morsch wrote: post #4

"Endotheliitis is an immune response within the endothelium in blood vessels, in which they become inflamed. The condition can cause oedema of the surrounding tissue, including the stroma, and can cause irritation and pain. If it is within the cornea, it can result in permanent loss of vision. The condition can be caused by a number of factors, such as mumps and cytomegalovirus under certain circumstances." (Wikipedi…

[deleted]

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Impairs Endothelial Function via Downregulation of ACE2

#17

Post by busyant »

unanswered wrote: post #3

If this is a function of the spike protein, doesn't that mean the mRNA vaccines cause this effect as well?

This is a legitimate question, so I don't know why it's being downvoted. Especially given the statement in the abstract of the paper that says, "We show here that S protein alone can damage vascular endothelial cells (ECs) in vitro and in vivo...."

That being said, other people on this thread have provided reasonable mechanistic explanations as to why the vaccines would not have this effect, but I will also add we have _empirical_ evidence that the vaccine does not impair endothelial function (or at least it is extremely rare) because we have millions of people who have received the vaccine without impaired endothelial function.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Impairs Endothelial Function via Downregulation of ACE2

#18

Post by karmicthreat »

ronri19 wrote: post #8
TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The spike protein from the virus bands to ACE2 receptor, messing them up. The vaccine primes our bodies to attack the spike protein, preventing it from binding to ACE2 and thus preventing it from messing up ACE2 receptors.

But the vaccine causes the body to produce spike protein. The CDC emphasizes the spike protein is harmless, but this new research finds that the spike protein itself can cause damage. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different...

Your body is non-stop taking damage every day. Its when the body can't compensate fast enough that its a problem.

The load from an mRNA vaccine is miniscule compared to severe, or moderate covid.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Impairs Endothelial Function via Downregulation of ACE2

#19

Post by platz »

gameswithgo wrote: post #10
ronri19 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But the vaccine causes the body to produce spike protein. The CDC emphasizes the spike protein is harmless, but this new research finds that the spike protein itself can cause damage. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different...

This has been the clever guy hot take for a few days now. Yet millions of people are walking around vaccinated without damage, so....

It's a question hacker mindset would ask. What follows from first principles given the headline; it's not an unreasonable question, even if there is no empirical evidence the vaccines are unsafe
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