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“About one-third of Basecamp employees accepted buyouts today”

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Re: “About one-third of Basecamp employees accepted buyouts today”

#211

Post by goatinaboat »

mark_l_watson wrote: post #105

I have a different take on this, different than most comments here: I think that the founders/owners knew what they were doing based on reading their book and lightly following them. I have never been a customer. I know that I am just guessing, but they might have been making the lifestyle decision that they wanted a smaller and more focused company that was more joyful to manage/run. Also, I have some sympathy for a…

no one should be allowed to say or do anything at work that makes anyone uncomfortable in a personal way

I agree with this but plot twist: in a world where “silence is violence” you cannot choose to simply opt out.

Re: “About one-third of Basecamp employees accepted buyouts today”

#212

Post by leadingthenet »

deanCommie wrote: post #120
mark_l_watson wrote: post #105

I have a different take on this, different than most comments here: I think that the founders/owners knew what they were doing based on reading their book and lightly following them. I have never been a customer. I know that I am just guessing, but they might have been making the lifestyle decision that they wanted a smaller and more focused company that was more joyful to manage/run. Also, I have some sympathy for a…

> no one should be allowed to say or do anything at work that makes anyone uncomfortable in a personal way; Agreed. But frequently calling that out IS what is deemed "political" by the person who was "just expressing an opinion", and "i just have a different ideology from you" > ; no one should really care much about other peoples’ politics. Some people's politics is other people's human rights. Would you want to wor…

> Would you want to work with someone who you knew in their heart was racist and thought that people of your race were inherently less capable than their own.

Ideally, you wouldn't even know this was the case.

Re: “About one-third of Basecamp employees accepted buyouts today”

#213

Post by nostromo »

mendelmaleh wrote: post #44
TigeriusKirk wrote: post #10

If a third of the people were willing to leave the company over a decision, it sounds like there was a real, meaningful mismatch in priorities. Which is fine, but it's for the best for everyone to end that mismatch.

If two thirds were willing to stay even with such a good severance package, it sounds like most agree with the decision...

But are those the best 2/3rds of employees, or the worst 2/3rds?

People with lots of options are often the first to jump ship.

I realize in this case it’s likely more complicated than that because people may have moral objections to the change in policy. But the first to jump out of a sinking ship are the people who are confident they can make their way to another boat.

Re: “About one-third of Basecamp employees accepted buyouts today”

#214

Post by dboreham »

koheripbal wrote: post #146
grumblestumble wrote: post #89

A lot of the conversation from the "no politics at work" crowd here is centered around "these folks were wasting company time and losing productivity protesting this". That entirely misses the point. The loss of productivity around this issue is entirely on the leadership team. They let this fester - they were complicit in allowing this dumb-ass list to be circulated around the company for years, and when it became a…

Our experience when we issued our "No Politics / No Religion" policy at work was very positive. The few people who had an issue with it, subsequently quit or were terminated, and many of their co-workers actually thanked us afterwards for it. We didn't have to pay them to leave. One tried to use the company social media accounts to advance her politics, so we fired her, and the other person became frustrated that she…

I'm confused. Aren't such discussions banned by social norms everywhere for a very long time? I can't recall any public political or religious discussions at any place I've worked in decades.

Re: “About one-third of Basecamp employees accepted buyouts today”

#216

Post by Ar-Curunir »

baron816 wrote: post #181

What I think is lost in the conversation here is that people don’t really have organizations they can go to to advocate their political positions. People have their families, their jobs, and maybe a couple of friends and that’s about it. They need an outlet to push the ideas and causes they care about. The workplace is one of the few places where they can feel like they’re having an impact, but that’s not really appr…

"Workplace is inappropriate for politics" is a really ahistorical stance to take. All the things that you enjoy nowadays (8 hr work day, 5 day work week, no child labour, etc) came about as a result of organized politics at the workplace.

Re: “About one-third of Basecamp employees accepted buyouts today”

#217

Post by scarface74 »

Why would I want to talk about politics at work that don’t affect my job and what would it change?

Why would I bring up BLM and how it relates to the justice system at work if my company can’t do anything about it?

On the other hand, I would be more than happy to discuss having recruitment drives at Historically Black Colleges and Universities, expanding the hiring pipeline, equal pay at my company for equal work, expanding maternity/paternity leave, etc.

Re: “About one-third of Basecamp employees accepted buyouts today”

#218

Post by Trasmatta »

danieljacksonno wrote: post #208
Trasmatta wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, DHH is very outspoken politically, and fairly progressive. Of course there was going to be a selection bias where they hired similar people. This shouldn't have come as a surprise to them, and they should have realized the backlash. Shockingly bad foresight.

It's not that long ago that hiring a progressive usually meant hiring a tolerant person who would go the extra mile to include everyone, also people they disagreed with. It's only recently that parts of the progressive movement has radicalized.

> a tolerant person who would go the extra mile to include everyone, also people they disagreed with

That sounds like the definition of liberalism rather than progressivism. I don't think the progressive movement has ever really fit under your definition -- or even wanted to. I think what you may be seeing is more people shifting from liberalism to progressivism (at least in certain communities like this).

Re: “About one-third of Basecamp employees accepted buyouts today”

#219

Post by grumblestumble »

corey_moncure wrote: post #156
grumblestumble wrote: post #89

A lot of the conversation from the "no politics at work" crowd here is centered around "these folks were wasting company time and losing productivity protesting this". That entirely misses the point. The loss of productivity around this issue is entirely on the leadership team. They let this fester - they were complicit in allowing this dumb-ass list to be circulated around the company for years, and when it became a…

Someday you will look back on a world where it was okay to laugh at things, and perhaps you will even remember writing this comment.

I'm generally perceived as a pretty funny guy, I joke around with both my reports and those I report to, and, yes, even with customers all the time. I've found that I don't need to diminish others to do this, there's plenty of other crap to joke about, like the quality of our products, how long it takes to get stuff done, the UX of the tools we share, dumb programming trends. It's easy to laugh without it being at the expense of others.

Re: “About one-third of Basecamp employees accepted buyouts today”

#220

Post by toiletfuneral »

odshoifsdhfs wrote: post #87
danjac wrote: post #18

I wouldn't be surprised if this will become a case study in future in how to self-destruct a successful company with a single bad communication, much like Gerald Ratner (although this may be due to long-term grievances we're not aware of).

Depends I will be looking and reaching out to them soon. A) they are now looking for a lot of people. B) I fully agree with their idea about apolitical work spaces, and I know a lot of folks that do as well. I have quit jobs due to the BLM fanfare, you are either with us or against us mentality in the workplace where I just wanted to do my job and get paid to do so. edit: I chose BLM because it was the big thing last…

I'm sorry, my life is surrounded by extremely liberal people but I've never seen anyone 'demanding someone wear a BLM thing". Similar to the "war on Christmas" I think that someone made that up.
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