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Yayagram

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Re: Yayagram

#41

Post by nerdponx »

grok22 wrote: post #37
lacker wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of companies and people don't really appreciate how much training is really needed to operate even the simplest of mobile phones. I completely agree, but at the same time it's funny that you can take a two-year-old without any formal technology training at all, accidentally leave an iPad where they can get it, and before long they're showing you gesture commands you didn't even know about.

Yeah, this is something I too struggle to understand. A kid new to it quickly gets the basics of an iPad. But a grandma struggles with it. Maybe all their preconceived notions cause a mental barrier for some older folks in adopting new technology? Maybe it's just that people are variable in their adaptability and there probably will be kids too who find using an iPad really hard.

Maybe all their preconceived notions cause a mental barrier for some older folks in adopting new technology?

I've observed this as well. The hardest part are the basic concepts. Examples:

- The idea of a "settings menu" itself is somewhat of an alien concept and mostly limited to devices with screens.

- Not all UI elements have obvious meanings if you aren't already used to them.

- The input device itself might be unfamiliar (mouse, keyboard, touchscreen) and the user's brain might be busy trying to understand how to interact with the device at all, let alone do useful things with it.

- Some users never learned the "why" or even the "what" of existing devices, only the "how" -- they don't understand concepts like "applications", they just follow very specific steps that someone laid out for accomplishing specific tasks. This makes it very difficult to discover functionality or adapt to a different UI, because they don't know what anything actually is in the first place.

Re: Yayagram

#42

Post by notwhereyouare »

nanna wrote: post #26
nanna wrote: post #16

This is cute but bearing in mind most of today's grandparents (at least in the West) have had decades of using computers professionally and at least a good few years using tablets and smartphones, I really think the pitch should be directed elsewhere. I especially don't think they would appreciate a 'telegram' feature! Also, I know it's not meant literally, but its genderisation as 'granny' is a really problematic cl…

Look, let me put this another way, since I'm being downvoted. I think my 70 year old mum, who is a grandma, would find it patronising and sexist to have a device pitched to her as an easier to use version of the iPad she is a bloody master of in every way. She's far more adapt than my dad, bless him, but even he can use WhatsApp and the like fine after being shown.

you put an ipad in front of my 80 year old grandma and she'll have NO idea how to use it. Even after training her and walking her through using it multiple times. She just won't remember.

This device is basic and captures all the needs. I think the only other cool feature would be a way to receive voice chats back and play them to her

Re: Yayagram

#43

Post by dang »

coolspot wrote: post #28

See also: ad-free smart TV for elders - https://m.habr.com/ru/post/511060/

Does anybody work on translating the best habr.com articles into English?

Re: Yayagram

#44

Post by dang »

andrewzah wrote: post #33
nanna wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look, let me put this another way, since I'm being downvoted. I think my 70 year old mum, who is a grandma, would find it patronising and sexist to have a device pitched to her as an easier to use version of the iPad she is a bloody master of in every way. She's far more adapt than my dad, bless him, but even he can use WhatsApp and the like fine after being shown.

It's called that because they made it specifically for their grandmother. Do we really need to state that it's going to depend on the particular person and their needs? Also, that grandmother is _96_. That is not even remotely close to someone in their ~70s. It is also dependent on the person: one of my grandmothers (around 70) doesn't like ipads, and can operate phones a little bit. My other grandma, similar age, lo…

Please don't post in the flamewar style to HN. If you're answering a comment that you think is incorrect, do so in a netural and/or friendly way. Otherwise you just make the thread worse, no matter how right you are or feel you are.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Yayagram

#45

Post by crusty »

lacker wrote: post #30
sdflhasjd wrote: post #11

When I'm asked to find some phone or other technology for an elderly relative, I'm always concerned about the usability of devices. A lot of companies and people don't realy appreciate how much training is really needed to operate even the simplest of mobile phones. I've not really seen any solutions other than making buttons bigger and reducing menu options, I'm sure these are great for those with deteriorating eyes…

A lot of companies and people don't really appreciate how much training is really needed to operate even the simplest of mobile phones. I completely agree, but at the same time it's funny that you can take a two-year-old without any formal technology training at all, accidentally leave an iPad where they can get it, and before long they're showing you gesture commands you didn't even know about.

My experience with this differential leads me to believe the train stems largely from caution and expectations.

A small child has zero degree of caution. An older person knows they don't know and worries that ignorance will somehow break the device (permanently or temporarily).

A small child usually doesn't have a formal expectation of what they are trying to achieve, it's largely experimentation, maybe with the intent to discover fun or find games, but it's pretty basic. An older person often will have a very specific y'all they would like to accomplish while being aware they aren't totally sure the device can do it, and if it can, how exactly to get the device to do it.

I think these two inputs create a feedback loop that works to promote technology acquisition in children and retard it among older people.

Re: Yayagram

#46

Post by andrewzah »

dang wrote: post #44
andrewzah wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's called that because they made it specifically for their grandmother. Do we really need to state that it's going to depend on the particular person and their needs? Also, that grandmother is _96_. That is not even remotely close to someone in their ~70s. It is also dependent on the person: one of my grandmothers (around 70) doesn't like ipads, and can operate phones a little bit. My other grandma, similar age, lo…

Please don't post in the flamewar style to HN. If you're answering a comment that you think is incorrect, do so in a netural and/or friendly way. Otherwise you just make the thread worse, no matter how right you are or feel you are. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

My apologies, will edit.

Re: Yayagram

#47

Post by psadri »

kall wrote: post #36
thirdlamp wrote: post #12

On top of the points others in this thread have made, I think this is also a lesson for UX designers. It's really obvious how the Yayagram works and how to use it and this is how our UX should be.

I absolutely love it but is it really obvious how the jack connection thing works? I would imagine only to former switchboard operators and modular synthesizer players.

The cable could be replaced with a rotary switch with stops for each recipient. I’d also add a picture of each grandchild in addition to the name. But overall, this is an awesome idea :-)

Re: Yayagram

#48

Post by andreygrehov »

dang wrote: post #43
coolspot wrote: post #28

See also: ad-free smart TV for elders - https://m.habr.com/ru/post/511060/

Does anybody work on translating the best habr.com articles into English?

I used to do it. You might remember there was a project called kukuruku.co – quite a lot of submissions from that domain were on the front page of HN. But, it was super hard for me to monetize the project, so I abandoned it. Fun fact: the founder of Habr wanted to buy the project from me, but I declined his offer.

Re: Yayagram

#49

Post by wanderingstan »

mtrovo wrote: post #34
ISL wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest problem we have faced, unfortunately, is the proliferation of modern security features. Chromebooks are awesome in many ways for the elderly, but the fact that you can't disable password entry at startup has been a dealbreaker for my aging father. He can't type easily and is beginning to struggle with passwords. Paradoxically, this means that he's still running his Ubuntu laptop (he has been using UNIX sy…

I don't know which brand you looked at but I'm pretty sure Chromebooks support fingerprint login for some time now (check this HP support page for ChromeOS for instance [0]). But I agree with the overall tone of what you're saying and I have the same kind of problem with my parents. I think the movement away from common protocols just made it worse, before you could have a simplified client just for the elderly or an…

FWIW, fingerprint login has never worked for my elderly parents. The combination of drier skin, shaky fingers, and poorer sense of pressure means they could never get it quite right. (And on iPhone, always ended up pressing the home button.)

I’ve noticed in the last decade that my fingers too have less oil and I sometimes have to wet my finger.

Re: Yayagram

#50

Post by nicoburns »

ISL wrote: post #22
sdflhasjd wrote: post #11

When I'm asked to find some phone or other technology for an elderly relative, I'm always concerned about the usability of devices. A lot of companies and people don't realy appreciate how much training is really needed to operate even the simplest of mobile phones. I've not really seen any solutions other than making buttons bigger and reducing menu options, I'm sure these are great for those with deteriorating eyes…

The biggest problem we have faced, unfortunately, is the proliferation of modern security features. Chromebooks are awesome in many ways for the elderly, but the fact that you can't disable password entry at startup has been a dealbreaker for my aging father. He can't type easily and is beginning to struggle with passwords. Paradoxically, this means that he's still running his Ubuntu laptop (he has been using UNIX sy…

You might want to try him with a password manager.
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