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Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

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Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#631

Post by bredren »

cainxinth wrote: post #624
bredren wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It seems that Apple has put in a lot of development resources into getting Octane to support Metal...and I can’t just imagine that happening just to support the the Apple Silicon GPUs. At the start there will still be a lot more Mac Pros running AMD hardware that must be supported. It may not be obvious, but Apple has repair work to do in the pro community. Four years ago this month, Apple unusually disclosed that i…

> So, unless Apple simultaneously was trying to honor pro users while also laying plans to abandon them... You say that like Apple doesn’t do stuff like that all the time.

Stuff like what? Can you give examples where you’ve known the company’s plans and intent?

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#632

Post by chad_c »

jjeaff wrote: post #600
hugi wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed. It's interesting to see how people like to label Apple a monopoly - a company with a 19% market share in smartphones and an 8% share on the desktop.

Is that market share based on total revenue or based on device count? I'm pretty sure it's device count. Which means we are comparing $90 smart phones to $1200 iphones that will result in thousands of dollars spent through the apple ecosystem.

This is so often overlooked -- Apple's revenue capture of the market is what is astonishing.

In 2019, Apple captured 32% of the global revenue for the mobile phone industry and 66% of all profit in Q3 of 2019 [1]. Asymco used to report on this frequently but I'm having trouble finding recent examples [2].

[1] https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnkoetsier/2019/12/22/global-... [2] http://www.asymco.com/2011/08/02/apple-share-of-phone-revenu...

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#633

Post by bredren »

raghavtoshniwal wrote: post #261
bredren wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It seems that Apple has put in a lot of development resources into getting Octane to support Metal...and I can’t just imagine that happening just to support the the Apple Silicon GPUs. At the start there will still be a lot more Mac Pros running AMD hardware that must be supported. It may not be obvious, but Apple has repair work to do in the pro community. Four years ago this month, Apple unusually disclosed that i…

Nit: Afterburner is built on FPGAs, they are architecturally different from the M-series chips and GPUs.

I'm not sure what you mean by nit.

Apple designed and released custom hardware that used a new slot to accelerate compute. My point is that this illustrates Afterburner as a product shows clear direction for Apple to put Apple Silicon into discrete graphics or other acceleration compute in the Mac Pro.

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#634

Post by cehrlich »

lostgame wrote: post #263
dcchambers wrote: post #258

I haven't yet used an M1 mac but based on what I've read about it I have fully bought into the hype train. Hoping my next laptop will be a M2-powered MBP, assuming they can increase the maximum RAM to at least 32GB.

There are rumours of a supposed M1X that may hit before the M2, so you may be waiting a little longer than you’d think. :) Of course, the Apple rumour mill; grain of salt, etc - but I wouldn’t be surprised if we saw an M1X that could, for instance - support 32GB of RAM by the end of the year - (which is the only blocker from me buying an M1) - and pop out the M2 next year maybe with an Apple-CPU-powered Mac Pro? Food…

Yes, I would expect them to have yearly M1, M2, M3, etc consumer-grade SoCs, and then alongside that yearly or maybe less-than yearly X-versions of the current SoC, with features like more RAM, more IO, etc.

So 6 months from now you'll probably have the choice between an M2-based MacBook Air with better single core performance or an M1X-based MacBook Pro with more cores and more max. ram - unless they decide to do the reasonable thing and shift the regular and X versions to the same release cycle.

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#635

Post by wmf »

alkonaut wrote: post #622
wmf wrote: post #520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple could easily fit 2x-4x the performance on an SoC so that's what people expect the M1X and M1Z to be. Note that it's still an SoC if it has "external" memory (Apple's "unified memory" isn't what people think).

> it's still an SoC if it has "external" memory I meant "soldered ram next to SoC with cpu and gpu cores", i.e. not DIMMs and 200W PCIe GPU. For a pro chip in a desktop form factor I think DIMMs and PCIe graphics are inevitable, and that's the interesting storyline in the evolution of the M1. We know they'll produce better M1's, but the integration with 3rd party graphics, the choice of DIMM type and so on is interes…

They may never have DIMMs. Apple is crazy enough to solder 256GB and call it a day. People would complain... and then they'd still buy it.

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#636

Post by atonse »

thruhiker wrote: post #570
atonse wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Compared to M1? Because my Intel MBP has done that for years. I now use an M1 mac mini with two 4k monitors (not from one cable though)

I have a 2018 Mac Mini driving two 4K displays with Display Port over USB-C cables. I previously was driving 2 x 24" 2K displays (same cables) and had no performance problems. Once I upgraded to the 4K displays I've observed very noticeable display draw performance issues. It's not enough for me to give up the 4K displays but I'm wondering if this is improved on the current M1 Mac mini?

I haven’t noticed any display lag on my end. But I don’t do latency sensitive things like gaming.

1 monitor (Dell P2715Q) is hooked up using DisplayPort. The other (LG 27” IPS 4K) is using HDMI 2.0. Both are running 4K retina at 60Hz without any issues.

I had so much trouble finding this out before I bought it which is why I am vocal about the fact that it works.

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#637

Post by lumost »

sesteel wrote: post #28
lumost wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm really curious how this will play out. DataCenters haven't been apple's market for a long time, and the requirements of datacenter customers are kinda anti-apple these days. More likely I would see Apple making an exclusive server chip licensing arrangement with ARM or something similar.

High throughput at relatively low power. To me, it seems like a match made in heaven. There is the practicality of building rock solid containerization on these CPUs. I don't know where that stands, but it seems like an obvious fit.

It would be great, but do you see Apple making commodity datacenter hardware for running Linux/Windows?

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#638

Post by enos_feedler »

1123581321 wrote: post #522
enos_feedler wrote: post #511

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the consumer space there are only 2 paths for a viable competitor to emerge. 1) a coordinated ecosystem attack or 2) an individual company doubles down. There are things that lead me to believe 1) can't happen. Google ultimately acquiring Fitbit instead of ecosystem compatibility and integration. It seems like the giants are needing to acquire the pieces to build their own Apple, rather than partner with them. Als…

There's also 3) which is another sea change in computing, something that would lead to current device categories becoming irrelevant, and a currently overlooked company positioned to capitalize on it. To me, that seems more likely than 1 and 2, and due to the acceleration of the rates of consumer adoption, it should happen relatively soon.

Yes, that is a good point. It's also hard to know what this is. But for me, the end game of computing is just computing everywhere, reading the world and writing to our screens and our touches programming everything around us. Ultimately this is going to be an ecosystem, not a company. Maybe some better standards emerge that can tie everything together. But as far as devices go it seems to processors, network, storage, sensors everywhere. It's going to be hard to build a new computing company on top of those things with the current investments in cloud and consumer devices, without just being acquired.

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#639

Post by nathanvanfleet »

amelius wrote: post #377
kumarvvr wrote: post #156

Somewhere, the collective whos who of the silicon chip world is shitting their pants. Apple just showed to the world how powerful and efficient processors can be. All that with good design. Customers are going to demand more from Intel and the likes. Just imagine Apple releasing the Mx chips for server infrastructure. Intel ought to be sweating bullets now. edit: a word.

> Just imagine Apple releasing the Mx chips for server infrastructure. Intel ought to be sweating bullets now. As a developer, I'm sweating bullets. Imagine a future where Apple is the only serious platform left on mobile, server and desktop, then developers can forget about starting that next disruptive startup and instead they will become just second-class Apple "employees" with contracts similar to Uber drivers.

You mean how it was with Intel and Microsoft for decades?

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#640

Post by nexuist »

nightowl_games wrote: post #595
nexuist wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple isn't harnessing magic here. The opportunity for competition exists, but everyone else is just sitting on their asses while Apple's chip team puts in the work. If you want to beat Mx, you have to think outside the box, just like how Apple thought outside of x86. That being said, I do enjoy the shift to ARM as the dominant arch. x86 has far too many decades of cruft behind it. I don't think Apple will take over…

This is a really cute pep talk. "Think outside the box. Just like apple did." But it is completely devoid of meaning. On what grounds do you suggest you know anything about how apple accomplished M1? Or are you just intuiting that it was some sort of "outside the box" thinking? Maybe it was raw engineering and management mastery combined with elite head hunting and millions of dollars poured into research and design…

> Apple isn't harnessing magic here.
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