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Tesla Q1 2021 Results

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Re: Tesla Q1 2021 Results

#521

Post by vincnetas »

natch wrote: post #498
vincnetas wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't like this direction of development. I would like to see cars in future used for transportation and not racing. There is no place for racing on public roads especially in cities. So acceleration should be irrelevant. It's like building bigger and bigger cars than other ones on the road to "be more safe" but at the end everyone is driving around in tanks (except other traffic participants like pedestrians and b…

It’s not for racing. It’s a safety feature that can get you out of a tight spot to avoid a collision. It’s also enjoyable. Once we get rid of human drivers in all cars then the first part won’t be needed anymore. When that day comes, we will be safer but we will miss the fun acceleration of these days.

People usually forget that they can also use breakes to get out of tight spot, which is usually safer, and by the way it has even greater acceleration (negative though). By the way high power and high acceleration usually takes you to that tight spot. Isn't?

Re: Tesla Q1 2021 Results

#522

Post by wlesieutre »

nixass wrote: post #506
wlesieutre wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany has more solar than coal https://energy-charts.info/charts/energy_pie/chart.htm?l=en&...

Don't cherry pick the data on a week when there's loads of the sun in Germany. Take whole "normal" 2019. for example: https://energy-charts.info/charts/energy_pie/chart.htm?l=en&... Coal - almost 30% vs less than 10% of solar

Ah you're right, I didn't catch that the default view is "this week." Thanks.

Re: Tesla Q1 2021 Results

#523

Post by dustinmoris »

andrepd wrote: post #429
dustinmoris wrote: post #418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Famous last words. Reminds me of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eywi0h_Y5_U

I don't see the connection.

> I expected Musk-hype in this thread but nothing quite so ridiculous as these idiotic "analyses"

Of course there is a ceiling which any product maker will hit eventually, but the OP made a prediction that Tesla could become the worlds biggest car manufacturer and the response to that was to label this an "idiotic analyses".

This reminds me of how Ballmer was laughing at Apple and literally 12 months later Apple was the leading smartphone maker and has been the most successful smartphone company to date and the first company in human history to even cross the 1 trillion valuation mark. So yeah... I wouldn't write off Tesla as becoming the largest car manufacturer in the near future and certainly not call it an idiotic analyses.

Do you see it now?

Re: Tesla Q1 2021 Results

#524

Post by TomVDB »

oblio wrote: post #328
judge2020 wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For reference: https://youtu.be/_aV91djgwEc I'm astonished this made it to production. Red tape and bureaucracy means nobody is willing to push back against a feature that is bad and potentially dangerous (maybe not any more dangerous than touchscreens though).

Acura is German, not Japanese, you're not replying to the correct comment, I think. Also, Acura's trackpad or whatever just needs a cursor. I wonder why they didn't think of that.

My 2018 Audi has the same braindead touchpad interface. It's completely unusable.

Re: Tesla Q1 2021 Results

#525

Post by ogre_codes »

ketzo wrote: post #240
ogre_codes wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> New S, X, Roadster, Cybertruck, and Semi models on the way There is also a lot of noise around the sub $30k mystery car Musk hinted about at the battery event. He said $25k, but given Tesla’s pricing history, $28-30k is more likely.

To be honest, given Tesla's pricing history and Musk's... claim-making history, $35k is more likely. But I can dream.

Musk is bad about price promises, but $10k is a huge exaggeration, you can still get the Model 3 for $39k. The Model 3 was available to anyone who preordered it for that price and was available for around $37k for some time.

You suggestion puts it around $3k below the cost of the Model 3, which begs the question of why put out a second model at all. If it’s not in the $28k or less, there really isn’t a ton of point to it.

Re: Tesla Q1 2021 Results

#526

Post by ping_pong »

Reason077 wrote: post #361
bildung wrote: post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the EV market grew much faster, e.g. +260% for Germany (from 108k in 2019 to 395k in 2020).

Sure, but market share should be considered as a percentage of the overall car market, not just electric sales. It's unrealistic to expect that Tesla would continue to dominate the EV market forever. It is realistic to expect that Tesla will become a significant player in car sales globally.

What are you saying?

How can Tesla be a significant player in car sales globally, when as a percentage of EV car sales, they are decreasing?

Think about it for a second and it will come to you. As more cars turn EV, unless Tesla maintains their marketshare, they will become less and less significant. They've lost marketshare in the first year that the major car companies have introduced reasonable EVs. Their 2nd derivative is negative.

Tesla is valued at 3X Toyota with having a fraction of the sales. What happens when the EV market becomes fully realized, but Tesla isn't the market leader but a small player. Do they still deserve to be 3X Toyota's market cap?

Re: Tesla Q1 2021 Results

#527

Post by ogre_codes »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #319
ogre_codes wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Teslas are still pretty new, but generally speaking leasing them is not a great choice. The terms are fine, but financially you are better off buying one and selling it after 3 years. They tend to hold their price a lot better than a Mercedes or a BMW.

That makes them a great choice for lease companies. Lease companies are popular for company cars in e.g. the Netherlands and the UK. EV adoption in that market is very high because of this reason. I agree it makes less sense for private ownership; though the lack of hassle associated with ownership is worth something to some people as well. Fully charged recently did an episode on second hand value of EVs. Basically,…

There are definitely reasons leasing is appealing, dealing with trade ins and resale can be a big headache.

I tend to hang onto vehicles for 7+ years regardless so it’s not a big issue here.

Re: Tesla Q1 2021 Results

#528

Post by api »

tonyedgecombe wrote: post #389
api wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if Tesla eventually failed, this is an achievement. They've fully validated the EV market. I highly doubt that we'd be seeing accelerating EV adoption like this without Tesla.

Nissan deserve some recognition as well, it's not just Tesla.

I own a Leaf. They're great cars, sort of the electric alternative to the Honda Civic and more economical than Tesla, but they're not cool or sexy. Tesla made EVs cool and desirable for car people.

Also the Tesla Roadster was slightly before the Leaf if my memory is correct. It was a super-expensive niche car but it showed what an EV can do.

BTW my Leaf out-accelerates many muscular gasoline cars. The torque curve benefits of EVs are universal and apply even to wimpier EVs.

Re: Tesla Q1 2021 Results

#529

Post by dagw »

dangus wrote: post #520
dagw wrote: post #499

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's possible for Tesla and Musk to overtake the likes of VW in volume -- if anyone can, it's them. But it's not certain that they'll be able to do it. It's not certain they'll want to. Much better to stay a higher end brand and focus on "fun" and exciting high end cars people (and other car makers) aspire to, rather than trying to out compete Toyota and VW in making Corolas and Polos.

Don’t forget that the VW group and Toyota very much compete in the luxury market. Porsche, Audi, Bugatti, and Lamborghini are all part of the VW group. VW is majority owned by the Porsche-Piëch family. Toyota has Lexus. Selling only luxury cars sounds appealing in terms of profit margin, but the automotive industry has a lot of complex systems with high development costs where economies of scale come into play.

Sure, but the big difference in my mind is that they both started in mass market segment and then eventually added separate luxury brands to their portfolio.

Tesla started pretty high end and are trying to move down into the mass market.

Re: Tesla Q1 2021 Results

#530

Post by mulmen »

kgwgk wrote: post #439
mulmen wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The BMW M3 is a different car than the BMW 3 Series. An M3 is as much a 3 Series as an Alpina B3 is a 3 Series. It is ambiguous in this situation. I had to read the comment several times to figure out if it meant that somehow BMW was selling more M3s than the whole 3 Series lineup.

>> The M3 is now selling more cars than Mercedes or BMW do in the same price segment. > I had to read the comment several times to figure out if it meant that somehow BMW was selling more M3s than the whole 3 Series lineup. The whole 3 Series lineup is not in the same price segment as the M3, is it? How could BMW sell more M3 cars than the total number of cars they sell in that price segment?

The usage is ambiguous because it may mean something like the BMW M3 even at a higher price is now generating more sales than the normal 3 Series lineup but those sales are not included in these numbers.

Using the name of a car from an adjacent price range in the same segment is absolutely ambiguous, especially when Tesla is competing on price/performance.

If you want to abbreviate it then call it a TM3 or something. The M3 has been a car for 35 years and it's too similar to the Model 3 for that not to be confusing.

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