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Roku says it may lose YouTube TV app after Google made anti-competitive demands

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Re: Roku says it may lose YouTube TV app after Google made anti-competitive demands

#81

Post by SR2Z »

agilob wrote: post #75
fra wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not quite ready to take out the pitchforks... > Roku says Google has threatened to require Roku to use certain chip sets or memory cards that would force Roku to increase the price of its hardware product, which competes directly with Google's Chromecast. This could simply mean Google is requiring chips with hardware VP9 support > Roku alleges Google has asked it to favor YouTube music results from voice commands…

>This is both what many users would expect So if your default search engine in firefox is duckduckgo, but you're currently on google.com/maps reading reviews of a car service, firefox should use google for your next search request?

This is a bad comparison. There's only ever one voice search button on the remote, but there are multiple easy-to-click search bars when you're viewing maps.

IMO, even if I had Spotify on a Roku, I would be fine with this change. It's not difficult at all to press the home button and then the search button to signal you want to search outside of YouTube. A big chunk of YouTube's utility is that it has music videos.

Re: Roku says it may lose YouTube TV app after Google made anti-competitive demands

#82

Post by inetknght »

calderwoodra wrote: post #57

Either the journalist has interpreted Roku's claims incorrectly, or Roku is spreading falsehoods. It's a very common practice for streaming services to make crazy demands about the devices they're on. Roku[1], Google TV[2] and Firesticks[3] all have Netflix buttons on the remote not because they wanted them there, but because Netflix forces them to with the threat that they will blacklist their device. And inevitably…

> It's a very common practice for streaming services to make crazy demands about the devices they're on

That doesn't make it any less anti-competitive

Re: Roku says it may lose YouTube TV app after Google made anti-competitive demands

#83

Post by rootsudo »

Nothing of value loss, the youtube app on Roku is very glitchy and the entire ecosystem of Roku is very ad supported and user hostile. I would expect voice commands within the youtube app to stay within youtube.

I am 50/50 on youtube music/youtube, but youtube app includes music so it's a general hard to decipher request but genereally if I want to voice search while I'm in youtube, I want it to stay in youtube.

I don't understand why people flock to it/use it.

Re: Roku says it may lose YouTube TV app after Google made anti-competitive demands

#85

Post by cma »

edoceo wrote: post #72
cma wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doesn't it cost Google more in either bandwidth or patent fees if they don't support VP9?

maybe. and that's Gs problem that they are trying to make Rs problem.

Not illegal unless it is monopoly abuse somehow.

Re: Roku says it may lose YouTube TV app after Google made anti-competitive demands

#86

Post by izacus »

015a wrote: post #55
fra wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not quite ready to take out the pitchforks... > Roku says Google has threatened to require Roku to use certain chip sets or memory cards that would force Roku to increase the price of its hardware product, which competes directly with Google's Chromecast. This could simply mean Google is requiring chips with hardware VP9 support > Roku alleges Google has asked it to favor YouTube music results from voice commands…

> if I have an app open, voice search works within that app This is not how Siri or the Google Assistant works on iOS, Android, or Apple TV.

Google Assistant on my Pixel 4 will search in foreground app if I ask a query so you might not be correct in that respect.

Re: Roku says it may lose YouTube TV app after Google made anti-competitive demands

#87

Post by SR2Z »

efdee wrote: post #61
sniperjzp wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, you can play YouTube without any problem on Firestick, they made the change 2 years ago. Second, you should give the new Chromecast device a try, it's far much better than Roku. Third, Google is asking Roku to support VP9, which is a much superior video coding format, I don't see any issue with this ask.

Either YouTube requires VP9 and then everybody has to implement it, or it allows other codecs and leaves Roku alone. What's the point of singling them out?

Because VP9 is much, much cheaper for:

- Google, who doesn't have to pay royalties

- Google and consumers, who can enjoy better compression and lower bandwidth

- Consumers, who can enjoy a much more mainstream video encoding format in not just YT but pretty much every app.

Google doesn't want to write off 45% of the set-top market right away, but at the same time it's 100% in the right to demand Roku support modern royalty-free codecs going forward.

Roku fights pretty much everybody nowadays and as someone who's been dealing with full-screen ads and missing apps on my $1000 TV, I have no sympathy for Roku whining about needing to support a modern codec.

Re: Roku says it may lose YouTube TV app after Google made anti-competitive demands

#88

Post by cptskippy »

smt88 wrote: post #27
fra wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not quite ready to take out the pitchforks... > Roku says Google has threatened to require Roku to use certain chip sets or memory cards that would force Roku to increase the price of its hardware product, which competes directly with Google's Chromecast. This could simply mean Google is requiring chips with hardware VP9 support > Roku alleges Google has asked it to favor YouTube music results from voice commands…

> This is both what many users would expect (if I have an app open, voice search works within that app) No, it's not. Most YouTube users have a different primary music app. Google is trying to artificially force a marriage of YouTube and YouTube Music because they have utterly failed to do it in the product experience and user base themselves. If I'm watching a random YouTube video and then want to switch to music, I…

As a Roku user who thinks Google takes a pretty hostile approach to anyone using their App on Roku, I disagree. If I'm in an App and search, I expect my search to be localized to that App.

That being said, f*k Roku and their voice remote. They've been pushing that crap hard. Showing prompts on screen for upwards of 30 seconds to push the Mic button. I don't want my remote to have a microphone or be able to listen to me.

I replaced my Roku remote last month because the one I had started having connectivity issues and missing clicks all of the sudden. The first thing I did with the new remote was pop it open and rip the microphone off the PCB with a pair of pliers.

I really don't want an Android TV or Fire TV, and I'm not really keen on Apple TV either but Roku is making it really difficult to stick with them.

Re: Roku says it may lose YouTube TV app after Google made anti-competitive demands

#89

Post by izacus »

coldacid wrote: post #51
post_break wrote: post #8

If this is true, could you imagine if Google tried to pull this on Apple? Making YouTube music show up when using the siri remote. These allegations are serious, and if Roku isn't lying it's straight up crazy.

Apple would laugh and tell Google to fuck off, right before removing every app for iOS that even contacts any Google service. They're about the only company out there with the clout and cash to give Google the finger without having to go to the courts (legal and/or public opinion) to do it.

Apple does no such thing in case of search in Safari, so why are you making this stuff up?

Not too mention Apple puts the same kind of requirements on developers and apps on their own tvOS platform - including UX behaviours and format support.

Re: Roku says it may lose YouTube TV app after Google made anti-competitive demands

#90

Post by cptskippy »

8note wrote: post #66
fra wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not quite ready to take out the pitchforks... > Roku says Google has threatened to require Roku to use certain chip sets or memory cards that would force Roku to increase the price of its hardware product, which competes directly with Google's Chromecast. This could simply mean Google is requiring chips with hardware VP9 support > Roku alleges Google has asked it to favor YouTube music results from voice commands…

YouTube music is a different product from YouTube itself. If I said "search wikipedia for thing" I'd expect to get wikipedia results back, not YouTube videos about wikipedia and thing

> YouTube music is a different product from YouTube itself.

Sorta not really. On Roku, Google is deprecating all of the other means of playing content (e.g. Google Play Video) and funneling everyone to the Youtube App now for everything.

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