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Feynman: I am burned out and I'll never accomplish anything (1985)

asc.ohio-state.edu

171–180 of 285 posts

Re: Feynman: I am burned out and I'll never accomplish anything (1985)

#171
post #51
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You also need tenure, more than anything else.

"You also need tenure, more than anything else." Sadly yes. An argument that the current uni system should be changed to make this not so.

The uni system couldn't afford to give tenured professors freedom to follow their fancy without the "underclass" working hard to make it possible in the first place — graduate students and untenured staff do the high-volume work needed to make profits: churning out tens of thousands of undergrads per year, paid for by fed-backed loans, and definitely not all of them taught by Feynman-type professors.

I don't know if that's true, that's just my model of how American university works.

Re: Feynman: I am burned out and I'll never accomplish anything (1985)

#172

I read (listened to, technically) this book a few weeks ago because I've always been inspired by the idea of Feynman and didn't know much about him. Honestly, I actually like him less after having read it. As I guess I should have expected, because its subtitle is "Adventures of a Curious Character", it's unfortunately for me filled with many more random personal anecdotes, often involving naked women, prostitutes, g…

I don't think Feynman was that different in this masculine or promiscuous respect from many of that era's greats... Schrödinger, von Neumann, Einstein, to name a few. Feynman at least writes extensively about his deceased wife. I imagine you would not enjoy reading history too much as the 21st C Western first world attitudes on these topics are pretty unique compared to any other time.

Dirac was purpotedly very on-point

Re: Feynman: I am burned out and I'll never accomplish anything (1985)

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same. I completely overbuilt a recent side project and ended up scraping the whole thing because it wastes too much time to maintain it. As much as I love building new projects, having children at home reminds me that time is my only true resource and it's better spent with the kiddos (at least at this stage of my life).

Asking because I feel this way a lot too -- is this the kind of thing that was avoidable (IE if you built it on Rails/Django + Heroku would that have cut down the maintenance), or was there intrinsic complexity to the project that made it unavoidable? More and more, I want to build things that are in the former category if I build them at all outside of work.

Depends on what you're building. Rails/django/heroku are web app accelerators. If you are building a web app, then yea they make it super easy and take away a lot of having to think about complex systems, but if you're building anything else not really

Re: Feynman: I am burned out and I'll never accomplish anything (1985)

#174
I've been thinking about this a lot since I first heard this story about Feynman. I've been in this industry now for 25 years and there have been three times when I wanted to quit. During the first two, in the back of my mind I still knew I wasn't going to and shouldn't. I'm working in an industry doing what I wanted to do since I was ten years old.

The third came this time last year. I had lost a parent (not to due to COVID), my business had failed (also not due to COVID), and then COVID hit so my prospects seemed low for employment. I found a contract with someone who turned out to be easily one of the most unethical people I had ever worked with.

Little of this had to do with technology but, compounded, I found myself in such a deep state of burnout that the thought of picking up my computer made me sick. I genuinely didn't want to work in technology anymore once that contract had ended. I was trying to decide whether I wanted to go back to school for something else or try to get on at Costco. The problem with going back to school is, I couldn't really pinpoint anything I wanted to study so I had all but made my mind up that when things opened back up I was going to put my application in at Costco. Hard work for lower pay but I have more respect for Costco than I do for a lot of companies in my industry. At least Costco solves a real problem and is beloved by their customers. They're not pretending to be innocent to fomenting sedition while making a buck off of abusing peoples privacy.

Fast-forward to around December and I had found employment back in tech. This company provides a quality service that directly benefits real people. I had quite earnestly tried to avoid it, though. It will go down as the oddest interview I've ever had because I was basically trying to talk them out of hiring me but to their great credit, they did anyway. Due to the nature of the job, I have a lot of leeway in deciding how to solve problems since I'm responsible for all of the code. I needed a simple log server for the various scripts that were running. I looked at all the Open Source options and found they offered way more than I needed so I decided to write my own. Almost all of the code I work with is PHP so I started writing it in that.

One Friday night after work I thought, "Hm, I wonder how hard it would be to port this to Clojure?" I had a little experience with Clojure from a contract I worked on a year prior while trying to bring some much needed cash into my business at the time. I could see the power and beauty in it but, still, coming from languages that descended from C, the syntax was foreign enough that it was tough going at first. I suspect that contract ended because they didn't think I was picking it up fast enough for their needs. I don't blame them.

Anyway, I found that I had actually picked up enough Clojure during that contract that my fingers started flying across the keyboard porting my log server. It was... so - much - fun! I was playing with programming again! I was exploring and learning and, importantly, being productive and solving a real problem.

Now, let's not kid ourselves, this log server isn't some sexy blockchain-containerized-whatever. It isn't a product that is ever going to be sold for millions of dollars. It isn't going to change the world or disrupt any industries. It is very simple and pretty much only helps me and one other person at the company. You know what? That's really great to me.

I've learned a lot over the years about burnout but they were really reinforced in a big way last year. It's important to step away from the computer and you need to do so frequently. We get weekends and vacations for a reason. Use them! Get outside when you can. Get some exercise in whatever ways you enjoy most. Eat good, healthy food with people you enjoy being around. (social distancing notwithstanding) Have a hobby that is not related to your job. I love technology and playing with it can be fun like a hobby but the fact is that it's not because my livelihood depends on it.

So far, 4-5 months later, that log server written in Clojure is still cranking away dutifully. I get a little smile each day when I check the latest logs to see if anything needs my attention.

Re: Feynman: I am burned out and I'll never accomplish anything (1985)

#175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dad of two - we basically don't, if I'm honest. I've had to give up on an immense number of things and while lots of people tell you "having kids is expensive" very few will tell you that the most expensive part is the opportunity cost. I have so many things I want to do and it hurts, almost physically, to watch other people doing them because they could hack on stuff after work while I had to deal with making sure a…

FWIW - in my experience, if their demands upset you, it’s not going to go well (you’ll get more demands and feel more exhausted); if you laugh at the ridiculousness of the situation, remind them to ask nicely, and still help them with what they need/want, you’ll be much less stressed, you’ll be teaching them that being unpleasant doesn’t bother you and doesn’t help but does have the natural consequences of slowing do…

True, and oddly given my comment, I adore them and love being their dad. But they destroyed my old life so I've had to build a new one around them. The pandemic hasn't helped.

Re: Feynman: I am burned out and I'll never accomplish anything (1985)

#177
post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An aside for future or present dad's (and all Parents.) There is so much joy and learning that happens with raising kids, that I think the secret is not fight it, but enjoy it. Almost sounds cliché, but embrace the experience. From the very beginning to when they are adults, to experience a window into your own life, a window into the world. These windows allow you to explore your surroundings and relationships with…

How do you let go of the things you want to do? I like to think that my side project is something only I could do, that the world needs but doesnt know it yet... so the thought of giving it up sends chills through me. You seem to have a really nice outlook on things so I'd really appreciate any hints on how to reconcile this and get to where you are! (I dont have any kids yet)

For the vast, vast, majority of us, nothing that we do individually is important. Sure we work and provide some value to somebody somewhere, but if we didn't exist or didn't do that job, the world wouldn't be any worse off.

If you think otherwise, it's probably your ego lying to you.

Re: Feynman: I am burned out and I'll never accomplish anything (1985)

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same. I completely overbuilt a recent side project and ended up scraping the whole thing because it wastes too much time to maintain it. As much as I love building new projects, having children at home reminds me that time is my only true resource and it's better spent with the kiddos (at least at this stage of my life).

Asking because I feel this way a lot too -- is this the kind of thing that was avoidable (IE if you built it on Rails/Django + Heroku would that have cut down the maintenance), or was there intrinsic complexity to the project that made it unavoidable? More and more, I want to build things that are in the former category if I build them at all outside of work.

In my particular case, I opened the CI/CD can of worms using Docker (which obviously has great use cases). My use case could have fit into a Rails/Django + Heroku model that would have saved me a bunch of time. I thought by investing in the infra early it would save me time later, however later will likely never come. So basically I spent more time debugging issues due to adding infrastructure complexity than developing the actual project.

TLDR; Wasn't a total loss as I did learn some, however I would have rather spend more time on developing the actual product (or in retrospect more time with my family).

Re: Feynman: I am burned out and I'll never accomplish anything (1985)

#179
post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every third party tool (or library dependency, by the way) is something that will have to be well understood, maintained and fixed when broken. Which is why I try to avoid them for the most part in my personal and work projects. When someone at work says "Hey, lets just use Xyz package I found online! It does just what we want!" you need to ask: Who fixes it when it causes a problem that stops us from shipping? Who d…

If you use third party libs with the appropriate licence then your the one that fixes it, just the same as if you rolled your own.

If you rolled your own, you invest your time to learn about the problem domain. If you use third party libs, you invest your time to learn about its interface/behavior. That is usually much more ephemeral knowledge. It is good tradeoff if the library does some heavy lifting, but that is not always true.

Re: Feynman: I am burned out and I'll never accomplish anything (1985)

#180

The meta-principle is that in complex domains there is no straight line, well worn, "plannable" path to greatness. Kenneth Stanley calls it "The Myth of the objective" and has spent the last several years trying to formalize this idea (within AI as well) and get it more traction. Book -- https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/25670869-why-greatness-c... Talk -- https://youtu.be/dXQPL9GooyI

In all probability, Youtube's algorithm will already suggest this to anyone who watches the talk, but there is a (very) long, ML Street Talk interview on this idea here https://youtu.be/lhYGXYeMq_E

Stanley addresses some strong and subtle criticisms here but I actually preferred the book the most. The book is a bit repetitive but has some very good ideas in the appendix.

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