Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4 • Hacker News Board

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#601

Post by foepys » Sat, Apr 24, 2021, 5:51 PM UTC

emkoemko wrote: post #499

foepys wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only that, there are entire continents where electric vehicles are simply not feasible. You cannot drive an EV 100km through mud and forests to get to a town just to charge it. Those EVs are not only very heavy and will sink in mud, they turn into bricks when empty. Have fun getting electricity into the jungle. A gas canister can be brought by anybody and filling the car up is quick. So most likely you will be ha…

well you could go to town and get a tank of hydrogen and fill up your tank and go? seriously we drove a electric car on the moon and your telling me we can't figure out how to drive in remote places?

Hydrogen transport is actually quite complicated. There are many villages where you buy gas in cola bottles, so I wouldn't bet on hydrogen to be available, even in 20 years. Gas powered generators will be more likely.

> seriously we drove a electric car on the moon

How else would you drive on the moon? ICE needs oxygen for combustion.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#602

Post by DoreenMichele » Sat, Apr 24, 2021, 5:59 PM UTC

akomtu wrote: post #584

DoreenMichele wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The optimal solution for that is better city and regional planning so waitresses and the like can find low cost housing near work and for it to be generally viable to make life work without a car.

These kind of suggestions prompt a snarky response. Imagine an emergency meeting to discuss the leaking co2 problem in a 200 story tower we live in. Everybody knows that the source of the leak is the old plumbing and rusty electrical wiring. Suddenly, someone shows up in the midst of the discussion and presents a solution: we just need to replace plumbing and wiring.

It's a little more like saying:

Everybody knows the source of the leak is old plumbing and the root cause is an old handbook effectively denying residents the right to repair. Let's update the handbook so that residents can do some repairs.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#603

Post by throwaway0xa » Sat, Apr 24, 2021, 6:42 PM UTC

mavhc wrote: post #528

throwaway0xa wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The $10 a month is a service charge to be connected to the grid with a meter, so you can send energy to the grid to get money back, or use the grid when your solar isn't generating enough energy. I think that's fair. It pays for the meter, the transformer you're connected to, the grid circuit, etc.

It's only fair if the people making polluting electricity pay to clean up the pollution they create

Your reply is nonsensical / a non sequitur. Where I live the local utility is 100% renewable anyway.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#604

Post by emkoemko » Sat, Apr 24, 2021, 6:55 PM UTC

foepys wrote: post #601

emkoemko wrote: post #499

Earlier quoted context omitted.

well you could go to town and get a tank of hydrogen and fill up your tank and go? seriously we drove a electric car on the moon and your telling me we can't figure out how to drive in remote places?

Hydrogen transport is actually quite complicated. There are many villages where you buy gas in cola bottles, so I wouldn't bet on hydrogen to be available, even in 20 years. Gas powered generators will be more likely. > seriously we drove a electric car on the moon How else would you drive on the moon? ICE needs oxygen for combustion.

take your hydrogen tank with you.... plus you can generate hydrogen anywhere using solar power.

using a ICE engineered for low gravity? with your own supply of oxygen?

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#605

Post by jfim » Sat, Apr 24, 2021, 7:12 PM UTC

gala8y wrote: post #577

jfim wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Who can afford to just waste 30 minutes for charging on a regular basis? The idea is that charging is done at home overnight, so that the high speed charging stations are only used whenever one is doing longer drives on a single day. As you point out though, not everyone has access to charging at home. Some employers do have charging stations, which can help since many cars do stay several hours at the office every…

Total off topic, as comments on older posts are off. As per your comment from 19 days ago [0], is it possible for you to write down something about your air quality sensors project? That would be awesome. (0) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26690347

Sure! Let me clean up the code a bit and write a quick post about it, should be able to get it done this weekend.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#606

Post by foepys » Sat, Apr 24, 2021, 7:22 PM UTC

emkoemko wrote: post #604

foepys wrote: post #601

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hydrogen transport is actually quite complicated. There are many villages where you buy gas in cola bottles, so I wouldn't bet on hydrogen to be available, even in 20 years. Gas powered generators will be more likely. > seriously we drove a electric car on the moon How else would you drive on the moon? ICE needs oxygen for combustion.

take your hydrogen tank with you.... plus you can generate hydrogen anywhere using solar power. using a ICE engineered for low gravity? with your own supply of oxygen?

I think you underestimate the amount of pressure hydrogen tanks are under. You need pretty large solar panels to power the compressor alone. So large that you can better charge a battery over a day or two.

Why engineer a new kind of ICE when electric engines and batteries are already ready to go as they are both needed for the flight to the moon? Also, you don't want explosions in space. Especially not when supplied with oxygen tanks.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#607

Post by cloverich » Sat, Apr 24, 2021, 7:25 PM UTC

billfruit wrote: post #504

aaronbrethorst wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best-selling[1] vehicle in America, the Ford F-150, had an average sale price of $47,174 in 2018[2]. I'm sure it's only gone up since. Also, the latest version of the map you shared shows the F-150 being the most popular vehicle in 18 states, none of which are California or New York: https://insurify.com/insights/most-popular-cars-in-america-2... --- [1] https://www.autobytel.com/ford/f-150/car-buying-guides/why-…

Perhaps something should be done to discourage Americans from buying bigger cars than they require. I don't seen any reason to use a big truck as their daily commute.

This is why it’s political. Gas is cheap in the us, credit is easy and to some extent, there’s a cultural aspect (at least here in Texas). Generalizing people like big cars here. Ironically enough my 4 door VW Passat had more backspeat space for my 2 kids which was my primary motivation. So it’s not about hauling kids around — at least for most. it’s about the size in general, the lack of disincentive, the occasional usefulness of a truck bed, perception that it’s safer (when you get hit by another truck, you probably don’t want to be in a small car like mine). combine with general ignorance of the climate issue and there’s little reason to not get one. Hence why so many do. I’ve heard quite a few people describe small and electric cars as hmmm various forms of “non masculine”. So all together... it’s a LONG way to go to improve the situation sadly.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#608

Post by cloverich » Sat, Apr 24, 2021, 7:27 PM UTC

hahajk wrote: post #363

aaronbrethorst wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best-selling[1] vehicle in America, the Ford F-150, had an average sale price of $47,174 in 2018[2]. I'm sure it's only gone up since. Also, the latest version of the map you shared shows the F-150 being the most popular vehicle in 18 states, none of which are California or New York: https://insurify.com/insights/most-popular-cars-in-america-2... --- [1] https://www.autobytel.com/ford/f-150/car-buying-guides/why-…

dang, $29k starting price and you don’t even get power windows? What happened to the F150??

It’s their primary money maker so it’s priced and advertised to maximize revenue. There’s a reason so many electric cars have ugly designs and it’s not because they don’t know how to make a good looking vehicle.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#609

Post by cloverich » Sat, Apr 24, 2021, 7:28 PM UTC

ethbr0 wrote: post #366

hahajk wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

dang, $29k starting price and you don’t even get power windows? What happened to the F150??

IMHO, power windows are just another thing to inevitably break. I have yet to have a manual window break.

Two cars i’ve owned for 10 and 14 years and the power windows broke once (on one side). cost me $150 i think. Pretty good value imho.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#610

Post by rconti » Sat, Apr 24, 2021, 8:11 PM UTC

argonaut wrote: post #391

rconti wrote: post #243

I've been following the id.4 release with moderate interest. I previously had a 2016 Golf R 6 speed manual, and now have a 2018 Tesla Model 3. IMO, the VW is just too expensive. Now, if you're getting the tax credit on the VW, and of course can't get it on a Tesla anymore, that makes the difference. But without the credit, the id4 is virtually the price of an AWD Model Y. For a vehicle that doesn't have AWD, has a to…

The standard range Model Y, which you can only order in-store/phone (so I'm not even sure if it's still available), costs something like $42k and it's RWD, not AWD, and has about the same range as the ID4. You also can't just say "without the credit." Once the ID4 loses the tax credit, VW will cut the price of the ID4. Tesla cut the price of the Model 3 when it started losing the credit.

The ID4 "First" edition with RWD only, 201hp 250mi range and 7.1s 0-60 had a $45,190 base price in the US vs a $49,490 AWD Model Y with 326mi range and 4.8s 0-60. (I had to go back and look up all the numbers I was looking at a month or two ago when I was following ID4 reviews. Apologies if you don't feel like this was represented properly in my initial comment).

Credits depend on what state you're in, and whether you're eligible, which is why I don't factor those in for the VW. When we bought our Tesla I think we got $7500 fed and $2500 state, so it took a clean 10k off the effective price.

As you mention, the base RWD Model Y, if you can get one, would be more similar in specs. It doesn't seem to be available anymore. Range was similar, it was sub-$40k, and massively faster I'm sure, than the comparatively glacial ID4 (we have a RWD 3 which is something like low 5s 0-60).

I agree with you 100% on the "without credit" part. Which is precisely why I stated it up front in my original comment. Right down to how VW may cut prices as the credit dries up just like Tesla did.