Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

nofilmschool.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 479 posts

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#81

Post by lrvick »

beckman466 wrote: post #75
lrvick wrote: post #57

Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. You can enjoy it offline, and in 20 years long after the studio that licensed it is gone. You can give it to a friend or loan it out. Or sell it. It is yours. Meanwhile DRM media we pay full price for, or if the content is only available via streaming we pay for…

> Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. I am so excited for my great-great-great-great ... grandchildren to find a layer of plastic DVDs in the earth’s crust 25 generations from now /s. Seriously, Blu ray discs and DVDs are such a waste of resources.

As long as the disk still exists /somewhere/, a digital copy you ripped from it is legal to keep and backup for personal use indefinitely, and transfer to a new owner of the physical copy.

One of your many rights if you -actually- own a copy of media.

Many sites offer DRM-Free music and books without needing to have a redundant physical copy laying around, but in video media this is extremely rare, and that is a problem.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#82

Post by lrvick »

SCHiM wrote: post #69
lrvick wrote: post #57

Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. You can enjoy it offline, and in 20 years long after the studio that licensed it is gone. You can give it to a friend or loan it out. Or sell it. It is yours. Meanwhile DRM media we pay full price for, or if the content is only available via streaming we pay for…

Do you think it'd be a good idea to force companies to open source abandonware? We could claw back space from copyright laws, and force companies to remove DRM schemes, open source DRM-ed copyright, servers and any/all assets required to run "the store" locally. This is analogous to right to repair, DRM "breaking" your property should be banned.

DMCA is no longer enforced on media where the device needed to play it is no longer sold.

You can go get almost any Super Nintendo ROM on archive.org right now, legally.

I hope to see this foothold extended.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#83

Post by Closi »

simondotau wrote: post #5

you never really own them Controversial take, but does "buying" explicitly mean owning? You never really "own" a movie you buy on blu-ray either—you own the atoms , but not the content which is merely licensed to you as it is with a legal download. The difference between downloads and physical media is actually less characterised by ownership and more by perpetuity of access. The key benefit of blu-ray is that perpet…

Buying a DVD is surprisingly similar: you are buying two things, you are buying a physical copy of something (i.e. a movie which can be played) and a perpetual licence to play it in certain limited circumstances.

Even though you 'own' the DVD you still don't get to do what you want with it - you can't do public screenings in the UK for example without further permission.

And even though you 'own' the DVD might not even be able to copy the data to your own laptop for personal backup, again depending on jurisdiction.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#84

Post by lrvick »

teachingassist wrote: post #68
lrvick wrote: post #57

Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. You can enjoy it offline, and in 20 years long after the studio that licensed it is gone. You can give it to a friend or loan it out. Or sell it. It is yours. Meanwhile DRM media we pay full price for, or if the content is only available via streaming we pay for…

> Wii store? Same story. You can no longer access your purchases. Not really. You can still play games purchased at the Wii Shop, you just can't re-download them. [Edited to note: Apparently you can re-download or transfer to a Wii U] That's not meaningfully different from having one physical copy: you can use the physical copy until the point that it's worn out.

"...for the time being you may continue to re-download content you have purchased or transfer that content from a Wii system to a Wii U system. Be aware that these features will eventually end at a future date."

https://en-americas-support.nintendo.com/app/answers/detail/...

It happened recently so there is a grace period to download final copies of a game, but if your console dies and you want to transfer games to another unit you get off eBay in a few years, you are SOL.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#85

Post by fsflover »

wildpeaks wrote: post #70
lrvick wrote: post #57

Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. You can enjoy it offline, and in 20 years long after the studio that licensed it is gone. You can give it to a friend or loan it out. Or sell it. It is yours. Meanwhile DRM media we pay full price for, or if the content is only available via streaming we pay for…

This is why supporting DRM-free stores is important (e.g. Bandcamp for music and GOG for games).

DRM-free media stores: https://www.fsf.org/givingguide/v11/ (scroll down).

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#86

Post by est31 »

beckman466 wrote: post #75
lrvick wrote: post #57

Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. You can enjoy it offline, and in 20 years long after the studio that licensed it is gone. You can give it to a friend or loan it out. Or sell it. It is yours. Meanwhile DRM media we pay full price for, or if the content is only available via streaming we pay for…

> Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. I am so excited for my great-great-great-great ... grandchildren to find a layer of plastic DVDs in the earth’s crust 25 generations from now /s. Seriously, Blu ray discs and DVDs are such a waste of resources.

There is no requirement to forefit your rights once you transition away from physical media. E.g. you could trade DVD equivalent rights on a blockchain. The blockchain including the proof that you legitimately own this copy would stick around for as long as people want it to, it wouldn't depend on big tech companies like MS, Sony, etc. I'm not even a blockchain fanatic but this is one of the few good uses of the technology I think.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#87

Post by lrvick »

alpaca128 wrote: post #76
wildpeaks wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why supporting DRM-free stores is important (e.g. Bandcamp for music and GOG for games).

Are there similar platforms for buying ebooks? I like ebooks but I'm not comfortable with all the layers of DRM involved in it.

I looked and looked and looked for an option here, and almost pulled the trigger on book scanning gear.

Eventually I gave up realizing it is an extraordinary effort to personally rip books just to have drm-free digital copies.

Instead I built a floor-to-ceiling bookshelf and filled it.

I read ink on slices of dead trees now, like a barbarian.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#88

Post by iso1631 »

lrvick wrote: post #81
beckman466 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. I am so excited for my great-great-great-great ... grandchildren to find a layer of plastic DVDs in the earth’s crust 25 generations from now /s. Seriously, Blu ray discs and DVDs are such a waste of resources.

As long as the disk still exists /somewhere/, a digital copy you ripped from it is legal to keep and backup for personal use indefinitely, and transfer to a new owner of the physical copy. One of your many rights if you -actually- own a copy of media. Many sites offer DRM-Free music and books without needing to have a redundant physical copy laying around, but in video media this is extremely rare, and that is a prob…

> As long as the disk still exists /somewhere/, a digital copy you ripped from it is legal to keep and backup for personal use indefinitely, and transfer to a new owner of the physical copy.

Depends on your jurisdiction. Ripping a dvd or bluray in the first place would be illegal in the states. Any type of format shifting (including say CD to mp3) is illegal in the UK - even if you did buy a drm free WAV, unless the copyright holder explicitly gives you permission to copy it to your phone, or another computer, you're stuck.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#89

Post by iso1631 »

dataflow wrote: post #71
SCHiM wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think it'd be a good idea to force companies to open source abandonware? We could claw back space from copyright laws, and force companies to remove DRM schemes, open source DRM-ed copyright, servers and any/all assets required to run "the store" locally. This is analogous to right to repair, DRM "breaking" your property should be banned.

How would you define abandonware?

I would require copyright holders to renew their copyright. 5 years for free, then $1 for the 6th year, $2 for the 7th, $4 for the 8th, $8 for the 9th, $1m for the 25th, etc.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#90

Post by ceejayoz »

alpaca128 wrote: post #76
wildpeaks wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why supporting DRM-free stores is important (e.g. Bandcamp for music and GOG for games).

Are there similar platforms for buying ebooks? I like ebooks but I'm not comfortable with all the layers of DRM involved in it.

You can actually find quite a few on Amazon. Example:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08QGM36KB/

"At the Publisher's request, this title is being sold without Digital Rights Management Software (DRM) applied."

Post reply on HN