Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

nofilmschool.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 479 posts

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#71

Post by dataflow »

SCHiM wrote: post #69
lrvick wrote: post #57

Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. You can enjoy it offline, and in 20 years long after the studio that licensed it is gone. You can give it to a friend or loan it out. Or sell it. It is yours. Meanwhile DRM media we pay full price for, or if the content is only available via streaming we pay for…

Do you think it'd be a good idea to force companies to open source abandonware? We could claw back space from copyright laws, and force companies to remove DRM schemes, open source DRM-ed copyright, servers and any/all assets required to run "the store" locally. This is analogous to right to repair, DRM "breaking" your property should be banned.

How would you define abandonware?

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#72

Post by SCHiM »

teachingassist wrote: post #68
lrvick wrote: post #57

Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. You can enjoy it offline, and in 20 years long after the studio that licensed it is gone. You can give it to a friend or loan it out. Or sell it. It is yours. Meanwhile DRM media we pay full price for, or if the content is only available via streaming we pay for…

> Wii store? Same story. You can no longer access your purchases. Not really. You can still play games purchased at the Wii Shop, you just can't re-download them. [Edited to note: Apparently you can re-download or transfer to a Wii U] That's not meaningfully different from having one physical copy: you can use the physical copy until the point that it's worn out.

The difference between the time it takes physical copies to wear out is much much longer than the time it takes $company to decide that it's time to force everyone to buy the next latest-and-greatest.

I've got NES cartridges from the 80s or 90s still working.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#73

Post by SCHiM »

dataflow wrote: post #71
SCHiM wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think it'd be a good idea to force companies to open source abandonware? We could claw back space from copyright laws, and force companies to remove DRM schemes, open source DRM-ed copyright, servers and any/all assets required to run "the store" locally. This is analogous to right to repair, DRM "breaking" your property should be banned.

How would you define abandonware?

I don't think I have the full definition.

But if you think about online games, it becomes abandonware if you can no longer log into the game servers?

Or if your product is dependent on DRM, then is becomes abandonware when the DRM servers shut down.

I think different classes of media will require different definitions of when they become abandonware, but I think we'll mostly know it when we see it.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#74

Post by anoncake »

afandian wrote: post #33
hyperman1 wrote: post #13

This seams the core of Apple's defence: Apple contends that '[n]o reasonable consumer would believe' that purchased content would remain on the iTunes platform indefinitely which is a flagrant difference between ownership of physical items and non-cloud items vs cloud items. This strikes at the root of our society's definition of ownership. Clarification should not depend on Apple, or even a court. This should be ens…

It shouldn't only come down to "on the iTunes platform". What about the user's ability to maintain access? I have a similar situation with Google. I've had a Google Apps for buisness account for a few years so I can can use email on my personal domain. I made the mistake of 'purchasing' some media on that account. I've since switched my mail over to fastmail but can't quite bring myself to close the Google account be…

Pirate it. That's easily more ethical than paying Google for nothing.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#75

Post by beckman466 »

lrvick wrote: post #57

Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. You can enjoy it offline, and in 20 years long after the studio that licensed it is gone. You can give it to a friend or loan it out. Or sell it. It is yours. Meanwhile DRM media we pay full price for, or if the content is only available via streaming we pay for…

> Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it.

I am so excited for my great-great-great-great ... grandchildren to find a layer of plastic DVDs in the earth’s crust 25 generations from now /s.

Seriously, Blu ray discs and DVDs are such a waste of resources.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#76

Post by alpaca128 »

wildpeaks wrote: post #70
lrvick wrote: post #57

Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. You can enjoy it offline, and in 20 years long after the studio that licensed it is gone. You can give it to a friend or loan it out. Or sell it. It is yours. Meanwhile DRM media we pay full price for, or if the content is only available via streaming we pay for…

This is why supporting DRM-free stores is important (e.g. Bandcamp for music and GOG for games).

Are there similar platforms for buying ebooks?

I like ebooks but I'm not comfortable with all the layers of DRM involved in it.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#78

Post by teachingassist »

SCHiM wrote: post #72
teachingassist wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wii store? Same story. You can no longer access your purchases. Not really. You can still play games purchased at the Wii Shop, you just can't re-download them. [Edited to note: Apparently you can re-download or transfer to a Wii U] That's not meaningfully different from having one physical copy: you can use the physical copy until the point that it's worn out.

The difference between the time it takes physical copies to wear out is much much longer than the time it takes $company to decide that it's time to force everyone to buy the next latest-and-greatest. I've got NES cartridges from the 80s or 90s still working.

> I've got NES cartridges from the 80s or 90s still working.

And I've got Switch cartridges that are dependent on Nintendo's continued online support.

My point was that a physical Wii still works and is still a physical object, so it serves the same functional purpose here as individual NES cartridges.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#79

Post by alpaca128 »

afandian wrote: post #33
hyperman1 wrote: post #13

This seams the core of Apple's defence: Apple contends that '[n]o reasonable consumer would believe' that purchased content would remain on the iTunes platform indefinitely which is a flagrant difference between ownership of physical items and non-cloud items vs cloud items. This strikes at the root of our society's definition of ownership. Clarification should not depend on Apple, or even a court. This should be ens…

It shouldn't only come down to "on the iTunes platform". What about the user's ability to maintain access? I have a similar situation with Google. I've had a Google Apps for buisness account for a few years so I can can use email on my personal domain. I made the mistake of 'purchasing' some media on that account. I've since switched my mail over to fastmail but can't quite bring myself to close the Google account be…

> but that's not a very mainstream solution

Sometimes you gotta get off the train that speeds towards a cliff, even if it means going by foot for a while.

Re: Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies

#80

Post by qohen »

lrvick wrote: post #57

Physical media lets you have privacy without logging when you watch media, what media you consume, how many times you consume it, or how long you consume it. You can enjoy it offline, and in 20 years long after the studio that licensed it is gone. You can give it to a friend or loan it out. Or sell it. It is yours. Meanwhile DRM media we pay full price for, or if the content is only available via streaming we pay for…

Relevant XKCD (from 2008): https://xkcd.com/488/
Post reply on HN