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Netdata: Open-source real-time monitoring platform

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Re: Netdata: Open-source real-time monitoring platform

#101

Post by sneak »

edoceo wrote: post #59
odyslam wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a bit unfair. In the docs we are being very upfront that you can opt-out of anonymous telemetry: https://learn.netdata.cloud/docs/get we use the data we gather in order to make smarter product decisions. We want to invest resources where it matters, so we need to know how our users use the product. We are also very detailed on what we gather: https://learn.netdata.cloud/docs/agent/netdata-security Lastly, we j…

how about on install you prompt to opt-IN to this "feature"? posthog or not, your target market is more sensitive to this telemetry crap than GP.

I tried this argument already:

https://github.com/netdata/netdata/issues/7366

Re: Netdata: Open-source real-time monitoring platform

#102

Post by antman »

andrewm4894 wrote: post #22
mekster wrote: post #11

All these graphs are never really actionable and are only of interest for a short period of time and you won't be looking at it after a while because they don't mean anything unless you know where and when the problem is. A sever admin wants "Incident" panel that only shows anomaly components at the top coupled with adjustable alerting mechanism and not just a dump of all the data there is blindly. There are so many…

Disclaimer - i work at Netdata Cloud on ML. This is one of the things i am focusing on most - how to package and then surface up "anomaly events" to the user that the user can then quickly digest and decide if they are or are not something that could represent an "incident". So human in the loop sort of ML to help assist and lower the cognitive load of all the charts. We have a first step on this ladder via the pytho…

Since you're creating an interface for python algotithms please make the interface public well documented and easily extendable snd allow it to have different algo per meter.

Re: Netdata: Open-source real-time monitoring platform

#103

Post by andrewm4894 »

antman wrote: post #102
andrewm4894 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disclaimer - i work at Netdata Cloud on ML. This is one of the things i am focusing on most - how to package and then surface up "anomaly events" to the user that the user can then quickly digest and decide if they are or are not something that could represent an "incident". So human in the loop sort of ML to help assist and lower the cognitive load of all the charts. We have a first step on this ladder via the pytho…

Since you're creating an interface for python algotithms please make the interface public well documented and easily extendable snd allow it to have different algo per meter.

Here is a guide around how to develop your own python based collector.

https://learn.netdata.cloud/guides/python-collector

Re: Netdata: Open-source real-time monitoring platform

#104

Post by andrewm4894 »

sneak wrote: post #100
andrewm4894 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disclaimer - i work for Netdata Cloud. We actually mask the ip address ( https://github.com/netdata/dashboard/blob/master/src/domains... ) so it's not even sent - we just send "127.0.0.1" as the IP into our self hosted PostHog. Likewise with any URL, referrer type event properties that could leak a hostname to us - we don't want that data at all so explicitly mask it before even capturing it in our telemetry system.…

Your claim is false; the IP address cannot be "masked" the way you describe. The spy telemetry transmits the IP as the L3 source on each and every packet.

I literally shared a link to the part of the code that shows we don't capture and record the ip address in our telemetry. You are being quite disingenuous calling things "spyware".

I do appreciate the opt-in vs opt-out argument and I think on balance if opt-out helps us make this free product better over time and help our users then, so long as there is a clear route for people to opt-out, it's worth it and crucially important.

But this is indeed more like an opinion that individuals might differ on in terms of the pros and cons.

I personally love sending telemetry especially to help make the products I love better :) feels like im giving something back. But that is just my own opinion.

Re: Netdata: Open-source real-time monitoring platform

#105

Post by dddw »

odyslam wrote: post #9
dddw wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, very handy tool. I once used it to discover that a new deployment generated spike CPU load. Reason was a badly implemented javascript doing a call on the db when hovering over a product (preview stock). Fun to see the actual correlation in a GUI in realtime.

Hey, That sounds super interesting. Would you be interested to share the use-case in our forums? https://community.netdata.cloud Ping me (@odyslam in the forum) if you need any help. We are always looking for awesome stories like that!

sure I'll be in between jobs soon, so I got some time to write something

Re: Netdata: Open-source real-time monitoring platform

#106

Post by yunohn »

sneak wrote: post #99
yunohn wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dude, seriously? You choose to willfully install Netdata. You have to read the docs where the opt-out telemetry is clearly explained, before you can self-host it too. If you care, you can disable it. I honestly don’t understand HN. Multiple commenters deriding a free open-source project for having basic telemetry to understand feature usage.

I feel like you are willfully misunderstanding: netdata transmitting the data without consent is unethical: it's not their data to send. I did not choose to willfully install Netdata - I don't use it because it is unethical spyware. Telling someone "if you stay where you are, I am going to do $THING_REQUIRING_CONSENT to you in 20 minutes" is not obtaining consent if the person doesn't, say, leave the building. Being…

>> Being in the hospital is not a blanket consent to anything the doctor wants to do

No, in this case, you willfully signed up for a surgery and decided to skip reading the T&C.

>> user has specifically indicated that they want that to happen

You did this by installing the software without opting-out.

You sound entitled and spoiled. And by incessantly accusing netdata of being spyware, it feels like you are not willing to have a constructive discussion.

Re: Netdata: Open-source real-time monitoring platform

#107

Post by odyslam »

edoceo wrote: post #59
odyslam wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a bit unfair. In the docs we are being very upfront that you can opt-out of anonymous telemetry: https://learn.netdata.cloud/docs/get we use the data we gather in order to make smarter product decisions. We want to invest resources where it matters, so we need to know how our users use the product. We are also very detailed on what we gather: https://learn.netdata.cloud/docs/agent/netdata-security Lastly, we j…

how about on install you prompt to opt-IN to this "feature"? posthog or not, your target market is more sensitive to this telemetry crap than GP.

I hear you, we know that our audience is sensitive to their privacy. We are all are.

Here are a couple of thoughts that have guided us. Thank you for engaging in this conversation and for caring enough.

1) This data is crucial for us. We need as much as we can get and it's highly specialized to Netdata. (e.g a sudden increase in crashes will prompt our team to see recent changes) 2) The more friction we add (opt-in), the less people will do it (because people choose the easier route, always) and thus we will have less data to work with. 3) People who care enough, as you said, about their privacy, can *very* easily disable the anonymous statistics, by both adding a flag to the install script or doing a small config change afterwards. I feel that we are communicating in many different places that we take anonymous data, so most of our users should be informed. 4) It's a fairly standard industry tactic and I don't believe that other solutions are not doing. Of course this is not an excuse for anything, just noting that we are not an outlier.

Thanks again for engaging. Feedback is great for us, it makes us both happy (because someone cares enough) and better.

Re: Netdata: Open-source real-time monitoring platform

#108

Post by cakrit »

Abishek_Muthian wrote: post #84
ohthehugemanate wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's OOTB configured to use their free cloud service, but with 2 lines of config you can run your own central collection point instead. That's what I do for my home install. BUT the UI for this is just a dropdown for each of your monitored servers. I've found I actually want to export data to a more robust system so I can view patterns across machines, too.

Thanks, So monitoring multiple machines is possible in a central console although not in a single dashboard. Hopefully it will be available soon and the project seems useful as it is as I like the idea of getting the system information of all the Servers, SBCs in my network.

This is what we do with Netdata Cloud. We want to keep the FOSS agent as a powerful single node monitoring tool and use the cloud for free infrastructure monitoring. You can see ktsaou's comment above on how we intend to monetize.
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