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Jonathan Smith walks free after 21 years of wrongful imprisonment

innocenceproject.org

61–70 of 149 posts

Re: Jonathan Smith walks free after 21 years of wrongful imprisonment

#61

Ms Haddaway made a secret deal with the prosecutors and the prosecutors did not reveal this. But did she lie? What this article forgets to mention is that Ms Haddaway wore a wire and got Jonathan Smith on tape that he committed the murder in order to get $60000 [1]. Here's part of the dialog for reader's convenience: "[BH:]Why were you in that field with blood all over ya? And they take, I seen ya goin’up the road th…

So this confession is "uh huh," which is about the extent of what Smith said throughout. The part that discusses the $60,000 and Smith describing the details of the crime is for some reason not included in the transcript. Frankly, his excuse of trying to get a strange pestering woman to leave him alone sounds fairly plausible, particularly a woman with a note from her doctor that she has "an extensive emotional and psychological problem."

Re: Jonathan Smith walks free after 21 years of wrongful imprisonment

#62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect at least half the people exonerated by the Innocence Project are in fact guilty. However, I think that sloppy police work should never be rewarded with a guilty verdict, even if it's likely the defendant is guilty.

I have a friend who works for ICE. She has literally deported assassins for the Mexican cartels. She said the hardest part of her job is that cities like San Francisco give millions of dollars to activist lawyers to help keep these criminals in the US. The activist lawyers and even SF know that these are real criminals but they don’t care. That money could be going to help the cases of real illegal immigrants who are…

If one of these "assassins" has an actual conviction in the US before they were deported, I'm sure you can name one and find some proof of this, otherwise it's just accusing people without evidence. ICE have no right to declare someone an assassin.

Re: Jonathan Smith walks free after 21 years of wrongful imprisonment

#63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do cities like San Francisco want to keep assassins in the US?

They don't. What they do want is for immigrants to not fear deportation, so they want to make a stand that they'll fight immigration enforcement every step of the way. Hence why they'll get involved with these kinds of lawsuits. Even if ICE purely deported only people who committed crimes other than illegal entry or overstaying a visa; you'd still have plenty of immigrants afraid of all law enforcement. Yes, even the…

If someone is legally in the US, why would they fear having their life uprooted by having to show their papers?

Re: Jonathan Smith walks free after 21 years of wrongful imprisonment

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most "illegal immigrants" are here on visa overstays, which is decidedly non-criminal. So you should refrain from correcting people about things you yourself aren't fully versed in. Source for most: https://www.npr.org/2019/01/16/686056668/for-seventh-consecu... More context: https://www.cnn.com/2017/02/24/politics/undocumented-immigra...

I said nothing about illegal immigrants. I’m a non-citizen myself. Here is the relevant law for you and other down voters: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_and_Nationality_Ac... Obviously, we’re talking about ICE so my comment was meant towards non official border crossings.

That's all well and good - but ICE doesn't just pursue border-crossers -- they regularly arrest and deport people here on Visa overstays..

Many of the people that OPs friend is complaining about receiving aid from San Francisco "activist lawyers" are from Asia, who obviously didn't enter the country illegally, hence, non-criminals.

Re: Jonathan Smith walks free after 21 years of wrongful imprisonment

#66
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a friend who works for ICE. She has literally deported assassins for the Mexican cartels. She said the hardest part of her job is that cities like San Francisco give millions of dollars to activist lawyers to help keep these criminals in the US. The activist lawyers and even SF know that these are real criminals but they don’t care. That money could be going to help the cases of real illegal immigrants who are…

If one of these "assassins" has an actual conviction in the US before they were deported, I'm sure you can name one and find some proof of this, otherwise it's just accusing people without evidence. ICE have no right to declare someone an assassin.

Yes, that’s the difference between an assassin and an “assassin.” With no conviction, a guy could be Mr. Rogers on paper — still doesn’t change the fact that he’s killed 20 people.

Re: Jonathan Smith walks free after 21 years of wrongful imprisonment

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So are at least half the people acquitted by juries. That's the whole point of the reasonable doubt standard. We believe as a society that it is far more intolerable to imprison innocents than to let the guilty occasionally escape justice.

> We believe as a society that it is far more intolerable to imprison innocents than to let the guilty occasionally escape justice. That's quite debatable. Our founding fathers believed that, but today's justice and penal systems (and political system that buttresses them) do not reflect that belief.

That may be more money than people speaking to some of those ideas.

While I agree with you on that core idea being debatable, I also see a lot more support for it than not. Clearly, my experiences are anecdotal, but they do come from a wide swath of the nation.

One of my tasty pleasures on business travel is to strike up some conversations with people. I have done it with all walks of life from homeless to rando joe and jane bag of doughnuts to people of serious means.

For profit prison is growing unpopular. I think it should. And that profit motive does drive a lot of policy aimed at keeping cells full, often justified in dubious ways.

One point in your favor is our trend toward aggressive punishment. People want to see the big, sexy verdicts and game over sentencing and often equate that to a greater measure of their own safety and security.

There is also very low support for better answers to what people do when they have paid, are out again and unable to build a life for ongoing punishment as an ex con. Fewer than I would prefer to see equate that to a lesser measure of security and safety in their lives.

All that said, I am definitely on the err on the side of guilt, meaning some guilty people are not convicted.

I am also on the side of corrections. The goal should be for people to pay their debt to society for wrong doing, AND while paying it, arrive at some plan, skills, resources to try again where it makes sense.

Not doing those things means releasing people who are extremely likely to fail and our results reflect that reality. Sadly, very large numbers of people respond to those facts with even more aggressive sentences, often openly saying we just do not need those people.

Rough topic, IMHO. There is work to do here. Not sure the will exists to do it.

Re: Jonathan Smith walks free after 21 years of wrongful imprisonment

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect at least half the people exonerated by the Innocence Project are in fact guilty. However, I think that sloppy police work should never be rewarded with a guilty verdict, even if it's likely the defendant is guilty.

I have a friend who works for ICE. She has literally deported assassins for the Mexican cartels. She said the hardest part of her job is that cities like San Francisco give millions of dollars to activist lawyers to help keep these criminals in the US. The activist lawyers and even SF know that these are real criminals but they don’t care. That money could be going to help the cases of real illegal immigrants who are…

The people know the difference between Filipina nurses and MS-13 gangbangers, and if there is no constitutional policy that distinguishes them, they’ll crack down on all immigration. If there’s no politically correct way to advocate for this, they will use anonymous forums: Reddit and the voting booth.

Re: Jonathan Smith walks free after 21 years of wrongful imprisonment

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They don't. What they do want is for immigrants to not fear deportation, so they want to make a stand that they'll fight immigration enforcement every step of the way. Hence why they'll get involved with these kinds of lawsuits. Even if ICE purely deported only people who committed crimes other than illegal entry or overstaying a visa; you'd still have plenty of immigrants afraid of all law enforcement. Yes, even the…

If someone is legally in the US, why would they fear having their life uprooted by having to show their papers?

Given that ICE has deported US citizens before, pretty sure it's a reasonable concern for immigrants to be concerned about ICE agents.

Re: Jonathan Smith walks free after 21 years of wrongful imprisonment

#70

Ms Haddaway made a secret deal with the prosecutors and the prosecutors did not reveal this. But did she lie? What this article forgets to mention is that Ms Haddaway wore a wire and got Jonathan Smith on tape that he committed the murder in order to get $60000 [1]. Here's part of the dialog for reader's convenience: "[BH:]Why were you in that field with blood all over ya? And they take, I seen ya goin’up the road th…

I suspect at least half the people exonerated by the Innocence Project are in fact guilty. However, I think that sloppy police work should never be rewarded with a guilty verdict, even if it's likely the defendant is guilty.

I agree with your second sentence. By the time the Innocence Project gets a result, the moral standard of "letting a hundred guilty people go free to avoid convicting one innocent one" is far gone in any case.
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