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.NET MAUI: .NET Multi-Platform App UI

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Re: .NET MAUI: .NET Multi-Platform App UI

#191

Post by manigandham »

andix wrote: post #187
bob1029 wrote: post #37

The amount of energy Microsoft is pouring into these front-end efforts is pretty incredible. A more recent development that has me very excited is Blazor Desktop: https://medium.com/young-coder/blazor-desktop-the-electron-f... > This leads to the second difference — in a Blazor Desktop app hosted in WebWindow, there’s no built-in web server. Instead, it’s pure .NET all the way down. And while we haven’t seen exactly…

The concept is revolutionary, for sure. But for now it doesn't work as well as a classic SPA architecture. The server-side mode works not very well on poor connections (mobile), and the client-side WASM builds are extremely slow. Especially on first load, this takes seconds. Blazor may be well suited for Intranet apps already, where quick&cheap development is very important, and connections are fast and stable. Blazo…

Pages can be server-side rendered and then hydrated after load, in either mode. This makes a dramatic difference in usable latency.

Re: .NET MAUI: .NET Multi-Platform App UI

#193

Post by manigandham »

flukus wrote: post #160
bob1029 wrote: post #37

The amount of energy Microsoft is pouring into these front-end efforts is pretty incredible. A more recent development that has me very excited is Blazor Desktop: https://medium.com/young-coder/blazor-desktop-the-electron-f... > This leads to the second difference — in a Blazor Desktop app hosted in WebWindow, there’s no built-in web server. Instead, it’s pure .NET all the way down. And while we haven’t seen exactly…

> The amount of energy Microsoft is pouring into these front-end efforts is pretty incredible. After winforms, silverlight, wpf, webforms and WinUI I don't want energy, I want to see them focus for more than 5 minutes. The only stable UI tech from MS with any long term support has been Win32 that came out 25 years ago. I predict blazor will be quietly dropped (they won't actually admit it for 5 years), just like the…

Other than Silverlight, the rest are still available today. Microsoft is unmatched in backwards compatibility. How are you being forced to rewrite your software?

Re: .NET MAUI: .NET Multi-Platform App UI

#194

Post by manigandham »

dt3ft wrote: post #157

.NET 6? Hold up, WPF was never really finished. This is demonstrated by existence of companies which sell lacking components that should otherwise have been included with WPF: Telerik, Infragistics, Syncfusion etc. Heck, creating a Report with out-of-the-box WPF is an unforgettable nightmare. I, for one, would prefer that Microsoft, instead of pumping all these half-finished "cool new toys", ships stable, performant,…

It's much better to have the foundations and build the rest yourself (or purchase what you need) instead of having the lowest-common-denominator come from MS.

There are a 1000 different ways to implement autocomplete menus and charts; that would be a nightmare to produce or use.

Re: .NET MAUI: .NET Multi-Platform App UI

#195

Post by littlecranky67 »

virtualwhys wrote: post #163
bob1029 wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We use SQLite for storage of all things. The entire application lives on a single machine. OurApp.exe: SQLite C# Services Razor Components When you have a stack like this, Blazor goes into additional dimensions of productive. Every F5 of the app is a complete stack running without any frustration in setting up databases, containers, message buses, etc. None of the concerns regarding scalability apply when you plan to…

Not familiar with .NET, but am intrigued by the Sqlite all-the-things bit -- can you run your LINQ queries client-side? (e.g. for offline capable apps)

LINQ is built into the core .NET runtime (and the syntax into C#) and available everywhere (I think LINQ was introduced with .NET 4 and C# 3.0 some >10 years ago). So doesn't matter if client/server or blazor. But you need some kind of LINQ-to-your-datasource adapter (i.e. to Sqlite, MongoDB etc.) which might have different availability depending on your environment (i.e. a Sqlite adapter would clearly somehow depend on a native sqlite client - but AFAIK is available in Blazor through WebAssembly).

Re: .NET MAUI: .NET Multi-Platform App UI

#196

Post by bob1029 »

virtualwhys wrote: post #163
bob1029 wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We use SQLite for storage of all things. The entire application lives on a single machine. OurApp.exe: SQLite C# Services Razor Components When you have a stack like this, Blazor goes into additional dimensions of productive. Every F5 of the app is a complete stack running without any frustration in setting up databases, containers, message buses, etc. None of the concerns regarding scalability apply when you plan to…

Not familiar with .NET, but am intrigued by the Sqlite all-the-things bit -- can you run your LINQ queries client-side? (e.g. for offline capable apps)

We use the Blazor Server hosting model, which is inherently incapable of running offline. For our specific use case, this is actually more ideal than any notion of offline capability. In this model, any LINQ would be running on the server.

Now, you certainly can run LINQ client-side if you were on a Blazor WASM (or hypothetically, Desktop) application. This is kind of the entire point of the stack.

Re: .NET MAUI: .NET Multi-Platform App UI

#197

Post by oaiey »

sandGorgon wrote: post #155
oaiey wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maui is targeting React Native and Flutter. Same for Blazer with Electron. They make this attempts to bring C# everywhere. Using Flutter, Angular or setting else is the context switch they try to avoid. For me, as a .NET fanboy, they are a year or two late.

this is very interesting. Are you saying that Maui will generate Flutter code using c# ? BTW, there's a very interesting (and amusing) bug that advocated "dumping Maui for Flutter" https://github.com/dotnet/maui/issues/160

Haha ... no. Sorry for writing the sentence like that. My fault. It is not a compiler target but from a business perspective the target audience they address.

Flutter with its Dart language and an own VM is not a goal for .NET. This is the .NET team building a UI framework for C#/CLR/.NET developers. Flutter is different from WebAssembly (which is more a CPU architecture) in that regards. From a .NET team perspective, they see themselves (most likely rightfully) as a full stack competitor to JavaScript and Java and that requires Browser, Apps/Desktop, Server, Web Pages and native Cloud in the portfolio. Dart, Go and even mighty Python are not in the place were .NET, Java and JavaScript is in this regards (yet and from a non-hacky perspective ;)).

Re: .NET MAUI: .NET Multi-Platform App UI

#198

Post by DiabloD3 »

publicola1990 wrote: post #169
Ecstatify wrote: post #168

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. Windows phone/Xamarin, Microsoft really doesn’t understand what mobile developers want. What’s the point in investing to learn something when it will be in the hospice next year.

Whats the story with Xamarin now? Does it have a present/future?

Xamarin was a company that produced several things. The AOT toolchain was fully integrated as a first party part of .NET 5.0.

Site note: 5 eliminates "framework" and "core"; 5 is technically a descendent of the core family (also skipping 4.x versioning, as it overlaps with framework 4.x), but satisfies all the requirements of apps that use framework 4.x. Ergo, "framework" is available on non-Windows targets and you no longer need to choose.

Xamarin also produced an entire UI framework. WinUI 3 (/w MAUI for non-Windows) is the intended upgrade path of Xamarin Forms, while the rest of Xamarin UI that isn't part of Forms lives on either in WinUI 3 or has designated replacements. In many cases, the upgrade is merely changing your `using` lines.

Side note: Uno has been using non-Forms Xamarin UI like this for years, substituting Xamarin's functionality when you're not on Windows.

Re: .NET MAUI: .NET Multi-Platform App UI

#199

Post by littlecranky67 »

IceWreck wrote: post #184

No Linux support

Not even Linux UI libs have "full" Linux support, ui wise. There is GTK, Qt, Tk, Xlib, wxWidgets etc. A single GTK/Gnome App does not look "native" on KDE and vice versa. It is totally unclear if MAUI would support linux, what UI lib it should adopt and it would still not look native for lots of users.

Re: .NET MAUI: .NET Multi-Platform App UI

#200

Post by CmdSheppard »

alkonaut wrote: post #177
dt3ft wrote: post #157

.NET 6? Hold up, WPF was never really finished. This is demonstrated by existence of companies which sell lacking components that should otherwise have been included with WPF: Telerik, Infragistics, Syncfusion etc. Heck, creating a Report with out-of-the-box WPF is an unforgettable nightmare. I, for one, would prefer that Microsoft, instead of pumping all these half-finished "cool new toys", ships stable, performant,…

The WPF grids are fine and autocompletion is trivial. Which is the proper way to write frameworks: make it easy to make the bits you don't have. I love that it isn't created like the old RAD frameworks where you are supposed to easily drop a datagrid in, connect to a DB and basically have some Line of Business CRUD on your screen within minutes. The Telerik/Syncfusion et.al. components are massive bloated and geared…

WPF DataGrid causes memory leaks - this is still the case in .NET 4.8
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