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Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

economist.com

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Re: Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

#561

Post by mechagodzilla »

ghufran_syed wrote: post #429
dredmorbius wrote: post #370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ERCOT's dismal failure the past several months has once again shown the fallacy of this thinking. Raising prices to infinity cannot induce supply of a good or service for which there is simply no capacity to provision. Nor does discrimination by price for life's essentials result in fair or equitable distribution when there is a tremendous inequality in purchasing power among the population, much if that itself the r…

“fallacy”? Or just an edge case? Are you really claiming that increased electricity prices wouldn’t increase supply of electricity in the long-run?

I think they are claiming that instantaneously and drastically increasing prices during an emergency effectively does nothing to incentivize supplies, because there are no additional supplies to be had, and that the right way to handle that is to heavily penalize failure to provide those supplies, and manage the risk proactively and in advance. So their solution would be more like raising the long term electricity supplies slightly, with incentives in place to make sure that failures like that don't occur in the first place.

Re: Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

#562

Post by a3KEaWOcZr »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #550
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For those of us to whom it is not obvious, would you explain?

Think of it like this. You can throw a lot of different juices and alcohols into the punch bowl before it becomes apparent that something is different. Pour a half shot of vodka into a glass of wine and the difference is immediate and off putting. There is very little tolerance for change in a glass of wine. The cultures of small towns really don't have much elasticity nor are they expected to have it. People don't l…

What's a city/small town culture go to do with it? Whether its a city or a small town, if a local lived their entire life (perhaps generations even) in a place and due to high demand was priced out, its the same. Saying its unfair if it happened to me in mountain ski town but its OK if it happened to someone from the Bronx is just hypocritical. Sounds more like I care about this now because its happening to me.

Whether you like it or not, the pandemic happened, technology has advanced, there was high demand in the cities for decades and now its subsided a little and the smaller towns have some higher demand too. Only difference the culture of the city/small town makes is how welcoming/indifferent they are or how much harder they will make it for the new comers.

Re: Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

#563

Post by 8bitsrule »

ksdale wrote: post #451
throwaway316943 wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s almost like it’s progressively getting worse as more people crowd in.

The very, very easy way to fix that is to build enough housing. Places don't suck because a lot of people live there, they suck for lots of reasons that are orthogonal to the population.

Canada's really getting hit. Market looks like a gaming table. Housing drastically needs protection from speculators.

Take Vancouver - even though they passed residency laws, with penalties. Average price in 1977: $90k. 2017:$1.05M. Average price dropped to $900k in Dec 2020 ... now $1.4M.

https://www.zolo.ca/vancouver-real-estate/trends

Re: Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

#564

Post by throwaway0a5e »

milkytron wrote: post #508
throwaway0a5e wrote: post #466

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trying to force density on people will fail because people don't like being told what to do and the government is terrible at telling people what to do. Just let people build whatever, wherever (hazardous commercial activity notwithstanding) and the suitable density for the area will develop naturally... like it did pre-ww2

Density won't develop at it's natural pace if we continue with policies that inhibit density, and fund projects that discourage it.

Hence the "just let people do whatever" part of my comment.

Re: Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

#565

Post by waheoo »

anoonmoose wrote: post #393
waheoo wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

What a lazy, unnecessary, unproductive comment. I'll not defend myself; HN would be better if both our comments get removed.

Defend yourself from what?

It's a valid question. But go ahead, dismiss instead of engage.

You're suggesting swaths of people are warming up to socialism.

What you don't realise is swaths of adults are waking up to these screaming children who are about to get smacked.

Re: Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

#566

Post by throwaway0a5e »

grecy wrote: post #439
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #425

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A second home isn't necessarily an investment, especially if it's a vacation home. It can be just a place you go on vacation.

By making that home unavailable for people who actually need a place to live, you're reducing the supply, thus increasing prices, and contributing to unaffordable housing. I say that as a Software Engineer who is 39 and has never been remotely close to affording even a first home.

That's because you prioritized spending your money gallivanting around Africa. You could be the owner of a fixed up fixer upper outside Buffalo or Cleveland if that was what your priorities were.

Re: Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

#567

Post by throwaway0a5e »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #424
RC_ITR wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Listen, nearly everyone largely agrees that wealth inequality at the current US level is bad. Wealthy people moving to low-cost areas (and thus raising cost of living) accelerates inequality for a few reasons. 1) Unlike you scenario, many working-class people in places like Sedona can only afford to rent their homes (25% of total, give or take in Sedona). These people incur huge monetary costs in being forced to move…

I’m pretty sure there is economic research showing that movement actually decreases inequality.

Movement by whom, the poor or the rich?

Re: Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

#568

Post by throwaway0a5e »

nitrogen wrote: post #420
giantg2 wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I'll never understand anti-gentrifiers." I think the main point is being forced out of your life-long home due to increased costs or taxes. Or the destruction of the local cultures/customs through change in local government policies. If you want an extreme example, you can look at the way that cult in Oregon took over a county/town in the 80s or 90s. Nothing legally wrong with it (the population segment with the hig…

The key is assimilation. If you move into a place with the goal of becoming one of the community and understanding and blending into the local culture and economy, people will be a lot more accepting. If you expect everyone to get out of your way, expect them to fight back.

>The key is assimilation

I think assimilation is too unprecise of a word.

In the context of these discussions nobody ever complains about foreign immigrants with a small army of kids running around and they're (at least initially) as un-assimilated as one can be. Heck, they might not even speak the language.

Meanwhile everyone agrees that Karen the corporate lawyer who shows up and promptly gets to work building a fence, calling in noise complaints and narcing on everyone for ordinance violations and unpermitted work is in the wrong.

I'm struggling to put my finger on exactly what it is but there's this disdain and unwillingness to respect local norms that makes the latter example of a newcomer toxic and unwanted (and IMO it seems to correlate strongly with wealth of the newcomer).

Re: Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

#569

Post by calvano915 »

Itsdijital wrote: post #339
calvano915 wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And destroys many aspects that made moving appealing in the first place.

Largely what made moving appealing in the first place was romanticizing the hell out of it while browsing lifestyle instagram feeds all day. You never thought about your addiction to 2nd day shipping and international cuisine rotation via uber eats.

I was thinking more along the lines of "small and quiet town living" with no traffic or crime but still has Costco. Hiking trails that are never packed and with no trash abandoned.

Quite suddenly, you lose the quietness while gaining the traffic and crime. Trails become packed and not well respected. All that remains the same is Costco except busier.

Re: Small cities in America’s Mountain West are booming

#570

Post by calvano915 »

whalesalad wrote: post #267
calvano915 wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Treasure Valley is awful close to OR which has plentiful options. WY proximity to CO mostly the same. Most probably are not swayed either way on this issue when moving to these states but when all the neighbors are offering options and are disadvantageous to live in, people will make ID or WY work to get the best of both. See living/working in WA and shopping in OR for tax advantages as a similar analogy.

I am thinking from the cultivation aspect. I love that here in Michigan I can grow my own cannabis 100% legally. I also love that we are starting to decriminalize active/psych mushrooms (Ann Arbor so far) for the same reason (home cultivation).

True. Growing your own is definitely location specific. Much more risky than buying and transporting small amounts to a not friendly state.
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