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Spotify is killing the open podcast ecosystem (2020)

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Re: Spotify is killing the open podcast ecosystem (2020)

#151
post #136
post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Spotify move sort of coincided with him moving from LA to Austin. After that move he's not been getting many interesting guests. Lately it feels like it's been a 45/45/10 mix of (to me) uninteresting comedians, uninteresting martial arts personalities and misc. Sometimes there's someone interesting in the misc category.

I see. Perhaps COVID has impacted quality guests from travelling, and poorer quality guests are more willing to travel. Just a guess.

Yeah, seems like it.

Re: Spotify is killing the open podcast ecosystem (2020)

#152

Whenever I can I listen to podcasts on their original websites. But there's usually one downside: their players are bad (seeking, skipping forwards/backwards) (I am also aware that bandwidth/deployment is not so easy for small producers)

Usually the MP3 source file is exposed on the web page. Sometimes I can right click and hit "Save as" and download the file directly (works on mobile too).

Other times I have to use an extension like DownloadHelper that locates the file path in the DOM and downloads it.

Re: Spotify is killing the open podcast ecosystem (2020)

#153
post #149
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I liked JRE, but even as a Spotify user, I don't listen to him anymore. Same. I don't know why that is though. Perhaps because he sold out open podcasting? Especially as he has had Adam Curry on a couple of times. But then I defy anyone to turn down such a payday (I wouldn't). Perhaps it's the abandoning of a very large community (YT comments). That doesn't affect me personally but I know it affects others. A subcon…

How about montonony and repetition? There are > 1000 episodes of JRE, each 1-3 hours long. An enormous amount of repetition results from this. I have watched less than 50 episodes and I know I have to FFWD when Rogan starts talking about divorce laws in California, using the same example of one unnamed friend who lost everything to his ex-wife. Podcasts with other comedians are unlistenable due to the constant navel-…

> How about montonony and repetition?

Fair point. Although I would add that recording thousands of hours of your own conversations would result in much monotony and repetition.

Re: Spotify is killing the open podcast ecosystem (2020)

#154
post #149
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I liked JRE, but even as a Spotify user, I don't listen to him anymore. Same. I don't know why that is though. Perhaps because he sold out open podcasting? Especially as he has had Adam Curry on a couple of times. But then I defy anyone to turn down such a payday (I wouldn't). Perhaps it's the abandoning of a very large community (YT comments). That doesn't affect me personally but I know it affects others. A subcon…

How about montonony and repetition? There are > 1000 episodes of JRE, each 1-3 hours long. An enormous amount of repetition results from this. I have watched less than 50 episodes and I know I have to FFWD when Rogan starts talking about divorce laws in California, using the same example of one unnamed friend who lost everything to his ex-wife. Podcasts with other comedians are unlistenable due to the constant navel-…

> Podcasts with other comedians are unlistenable due to the constant navel-gazing about The Comedy Store and cancel culture.

Yup. One notable exception to this is Bill Burr. I'll listen to any of those because Bill doesn't put up with it.

Re: Spotify is killing the open podcast ecosystem (2020)

#155
post #4

This post is essentially a funding pitch for Spotify. I talks a lot about they are going to try and kill the open podcast ecosystem but no evidence that they are making any progress. The podcast ecosystem is very different from other media markets-- it started open, it grew up open, and people are actually willing to directly pay content producers either for bonus content, to avoid ad reads, or just to keep the train…

What Spotify is trying to do is called a roll-up. This is a well tread business tactic favored by aspiring monopolists and the strategy is simple: acquire most of the distribution in the space, then jack up the price. (In the podcast world, "distribution" equates to "listeners" and price equates to "Spotify's subscription and ad revenue.") The harm caused to both consumers and producers by a roll-up is well-documente…

That's not what a rollup is.

A rollup is where you merge businesses doing functionally similar things, gaining economies of scale on costs. Its most often used for geographically distributed family businesses, such as Dentists. Dentists all need a lot of back office support, marketing, and sales functions. Having a rollup with a dozen Dental offices allows you to centralize all the insurance claim handling, direct marketing and put them under a single brand you can advertise on more mass market media.

You are correct that where rollups are used in regulated industries that limit entrants such as radio, they lead to oligopolies. If you own most of the radio stations in a single city you not only get the rollup cost benefits, you can also increase your prices for advertising.

But this is a direct effect of the market limitations that would occur either way, even if owners weren't allowed to reduce costs by buying stations in the same city to combine back office and operations, they would still do it to get oligarchic pricing power. And if you try to rollup most of the Dentist offices in a single city to raise prices you can only succeed temporarily, because it's a free market and your higher prices will attract lots of new entrants.

Of course the other criticisms of rollups is they reduce diversity of offerings. In the case of radio it leads to homogenization of station playlists. Which is exactly what the BBC does in Britain, so I don't see the issue. Especially since radio is being gutted by the internet anyways.

Re: Spotify is killing the open podcast ecosystem (2020)

#157
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What Spotify is trying to do is called a roll-up. This is a well tread business tactic favored by aspiring monopolists and the strategy is simple: acquire most of the distribution in the space, then jack up the price. (In the podcast world, "distribution" equates to "listeners" and price equates to "Spotify's subscription and ad revenue.") The harm caused to both consumers and producers by a roll-up is well-documente…

So this is what Apple did with the app store. Applications used to be distributed everywhere, but Apple tightly controlled the platform and crippled the web browser. They even prevented Flash and other runtimes so they would be the only way to get native control on the device. They "rolled up" computing. What scummy behavior.

Arguments that revolve on Flash being a benefit instead of the mobile power wasting security nightmare it actually was, always fail right there.

Re: Spotify is killing the open podcast ecosystem (2020)

#158
post #25

I guess I don't know the right podcasts, but in my opinion, most of them are lazy marketing efforts by large corporations. I don't want to listen to native ads. And this is basically everything Spotify seems to suggest to me in the podcast section. I fled Soundcloud because they couldn't get their shit together, it seems Spotify won't be competing forever as well. Their app has random stutters on modern hardware, and…

>I liked JRE, but even as a Spotify user, I don't listen to him anymore. I used this long podcasts to fall asleep to but had to stop now with spotify. I cast it to a google home mini and set the volume to pretty low, so I just can hear what they say pretty much, but at a random point spotify stops it and plays an ad at volume level 9000+ and doesn't resume play. How bad isn't that? Oh and Joe is getting less likeable…

> Joe is getting less likeable lately...

Agreed - he always had a noticeable tilt on issues but lately it seems to be all about scoring sick dunks on SJW's. I was also surprised how little prep he apparently does before podcasts. During the latest Elon Musk episode he learned on-air that the reusable rockets land propulsively (as opposed to using parachutes or otherwise). It's odd to have possibly the richest man in the world on for 3 multi-hour podcasts and not know the most basic facts about their accomplishments.

Re: Spotify is killing the open podcast ecosystem (2020)

#159
post #4

This post is essentially a funding pitch for Spotify. I talks a lot about they are going to try and kill the open podcast ecosystem but no evidence that they are making any progress. The podcast ecosystem is very different from other media markets-- it started open, it grew up open, and people are actually willing to directly pay content producers either for bonus content, to avoid ad reads, or just to keep the train…

>to avoid ad reads Even without paying for podcasts, ad reads in podcasts are pretty much the most consumer-friendly form of advertising on the internet. There's no privacy invasion. The ads are pretty well targeted because podcast producers generally know and try to respect their audiences. And they can even be pretty funny and entertaining when hosts can stray a bit off-script.

To add to your point, the only time I've ever consciously bought something from an ad was through a podcast, and I've done it several times now.

Re: Spotify is killing the open podcast ecosystem (2020)

#160
Podcasts are a symbol of the open web for me. They're free by and large, and largely not controlled by a walled garden platform. I can choose any number of apps to consume them. It's sad to see some big ones moving away from this model.

Just on Spotify specifically, it's a terrible client for podcasts. It feels like they've just bolted the feature onto the wrong product.

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