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China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

justsecurity.org

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Re: China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

#31

Post by api »

xbar wrote: post #18

New IP is an attempt to redesign IP into a top-down governance model. It is not a new "internet protocol." It is a "new internet" protocol where central authority is part of the design. I am morally opposed.

The CCP can force Chinese to use this, but why would anyone else use it? I can’t see the USA or EU changing architectures unless our governments mandate it, and I see no moves in that direction. We are barely able to get people to implement IPv6 after 20 years of kicking people in the ass to do it, so it will not happen organically.

Re: China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

#32

Post by api »

gaudat wrote: post #29

I wonder is it possible to isolate a whole country from the rest of the Internet? There are so many services in China that are almost exclusive to people with a Chinese phone number and a WeChat / Alipay account. That sealing the rest of the Internet does not affect Chinese residents using those services.

Sure. Cut the wires. It is now isolated.

Re: China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

#33

Post by orf »

1cvmask wrote: post #2

This is a hilarious scaremongering article written for those who are clueless. No surprise as it turns out it is from the comically named neocon outfit Foundation for the Defense of Democracies which is the most bellicose warmongering think tank in DC. They never met a poor third world country that they didn’t want bombed. As for 6G the reason we have no leadership is that Lucent was run into the ground by a mindset…

> We forced the world after 9/11 to block anonymous Internet

You didn’t, and it reeks of upmost arrogance to even assume that you could “force” the world to do such a thing.

Re: China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

#34

Post by refurb »

virmundi wrote: post #4

I am some what confused by this being called dystopian. As more and more Westerners call for people being canceled due to a small but vocal minority on Twitter and other platforms, wouldn't this design play right into that? Rather than wasting time defending Twitter, the reasonable social justice warrior would simply petition the sympathetic State functionary to flip the bad-person's Internet connectivity. For exampl…

I guess that’s one of the “silver linings” of China’s ascendancy to a global superpower - it will put their system up against liberal democracies and the choice will be clear - either a system where the rights of the individual are front and center or a system where they are not.

China has made it’s position clear - the west can continue with liberal democracy if they want. China is taking a new path - a better path if you ask them. The government will play a key role in guiding the country - the economy, social norms, education, etc. The rights of the individual will be subservient to those of the needs of the country.

And make no mistake - they believe their system will win in the end.

Re: China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

#35

Post by dkdk8283 »

api wrote: post #31
xbar wrote: post #18

New IP is an attempt to redesign IP into a top-down governance model. It is not a new "internet protocol." It is a "new internet" protocol where central authority is part of the design. I am morally opposed.

The CCP can force Chinese to use this, but why would anyone else use it? I can’t see the USA or EU changing architectures unless our governments mandate it, and I see no moves in that direction. We are barely able to get people to implement IPv6 after 20 years of kicking people in the ass to do it, so it will not happen organically.

Money. Australia is heavily influenced by Chinese policy, look at their stance on privacy / encryption / etc. Eventually this will percolate to the rest of the world. It will take decades but I’m sure it will happen. Younger generations are already pro censorship.

Chinas influence is strong enough to cause the AU PM to say stupid things: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20170714/10385237789/aussi...

Re: China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

#36

Post by na85 »

api wrote: post #31
xbar wrote: post #18

New IP is an attempt to redesign IP into a top-down governance model. It is not a new "internet protocol." It is a "new internet" protocol where central authority is part of the design. I am morally opposed.

The CCP can force Chinese to use this, but why would anyone else use it? I can’t see the USA or EU changing architectures unless our governments mandate it, and I see no moves in that direction. We are barely able to get people to implement IPv6 after 20 years of kicking people in the ass to do it, so it will not happen organically.

What happens when trillion-dollar American luxury device manufacturers are no longer able to contact their manufacturers in China?

Re: China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

#37

Post by [deleted] »

virmundi wrote: post #4

I am some what confused by this being called dystopian. As more and more Westerners call for people being canceled due to a small but vocal minority on Twitter and other platforms, wouldn't this design play right into that? Rather than wasting time defending Twitter, the reasonable social justice warrior would simply petition the sympathetic State functionary to flip the bad-person's Internet connectivity. For exampl…

[deleted]

Re: China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

#38

Post by echelon »

xbar wrote: post #18

New IP is an attempt to redesign IP into a top-down governance model. It is not a new "internet protocol." It is a "new internet" protocol where central authority is part of the design. I am morally opposed.

If China does this and succeeds, other nations will follow suit. I wouldn't put it past America to eventually do the same. These ideas are infectious.

We need to write laws now that prohibit this.

We also need our own tech and our own supply chains so this stuff doesn't sneak in.

Re: China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

#39

Post by quattrofan »

1cvmask wrote: post #2

This is a hilarious scaremongering article written for those who are clueless. No surprise as it turns out it is from the comically named neocon outfit Foundation for the Defense of Democracies which is the most bellicose warmongering think tank in DC. They never met a poor third world country that they didn’t want bombed. As for 6G the reason we have no leadership is that Lucent was run into the ground by a mindset…

Either you are Chinese sock puppet or an ignorant American. Lots of countries allow you to get online without ID including the US.

Re: China’s Dystopian “New IP” Plan for a New Internet

#40

Post by varispeed »

jowsie wrote: post #12
1cvmask wrote: post #2

This is a hilarious scaremongering article written for those who are clueless. No surprise as it turns out it is from the comically named neocon outfit Foundation for the Defense of Democracies which is the most bellicose warmongering think tank in DC. They never met a poor third world country that they didn’t want bombed. As for 6G the reason we have no leadership is that Lucent was run into the ground by a mindset…

> We forced the world after 9/11 to block anonymous Internet. You cannot get Internet anywhere without ID. You used to be able to get prepaid SIM cards in most countries till we put pressure on them. In the UK at least a pre paid sim is 99p if you buy it from a shop, you can pay with cash and there's no registration procedure. I doubt we're the only country in the world that works like this.

In countries where registration is required, you can simply ask a homeless person and they'll happily buy a sim for you for a small fee.
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