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Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

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Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#71

Post by xivzgrev »

SunlightEdge wrote: post #31

Unfortunately most writers of fiction make next to nothing too. Writers often are not happy writing either (unlike painters and video artists who seem to have a whale of a time). Sadly I toiled for 8 years on a novel (while working a day job). It was a massive effort. It might be hard for people to understand but I felt I had to write it (i.e. writers curse). I wish I had spent all that time on studying programming e…

I can relate a bit. I also wrote a book that quickly faded into obscurity. The biggest learning I had was I had no audience. I needed to build that first with blog posts or what not, THEN write the book.

I’m surprised that’s not covered here in this article

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#72

Post by SunlightEdge »

xivzgrev wrote: post #71
SunlightEdge wrote: post #31

Unfortunately most writers of fiction make next to nothing too. Writers often are not happy writing either (unlike painters and video artists who seem to have a whale of a time). Sadly I toiled for 8 years on a novel (while working a day job). It was a massive effort. It might be hard for people to understand but I felt I had to write it (i.e. writers curse). I wish I had spent all that time on studying programming e…

I can relate a bit. I also wrote a book that quickly faded into obscurity. The biggest learning I had was I had no audience. I needed to build that first with blog posts or what not, THEN write the book. I’m surprised that’s not covered here in this article

Yes that's a very good point. I was aiming for getting picked up by a big publishing house. These days though It's pretty essential you have some kind of audience first.

As I'm sure you know, marketing really is the worst. After years of work it's hard to be motivated enough to do too. But it's pretty essential.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#73

Post by SunlightEdge »

haolez wrote: post #62
SunlightEdge wrote: post #31

Unfortunately most writers of fiction make next to nothing too. Writers often are not happy writing either (unlike painters and video artists who seem to have a whale of a time). Sadly I toiled for 8 years on a novel (while working a day job). It was a massive effort. It might be hard for people to understand but I felt I had to write it (i.e. writers curse). I wish I had spent all that time on studying programming e…

The review that you got there was pretty cool! The reader was actually surprised by the innovative way that you've put together your narrative :)

Thank you ^^ Well... If you enjoy reading maybe give my novel a go :) You do need a Kindle though /wouldn't recommend reading on a phone. But no hassles. Cheers

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#74

Post by SunlightEdge »

systemvoltage wrote: post #66
SunlightEdge wrote: post #31

Unfortunately most writers of fiction make next to nothing too. Writers often are not happy writing either (unlike painters and video artists who seem to have a whale of a time). Sadly I toiled for 8 years on a novel (while working a day job). It was a massive effort. It might be hard for people to understand but I felt I had to write it (i.e. writers curse). I wish I had spent all that time on studying programming e…

I am slightly bothered by terms such as "Writer's Curse" and "Writer's Block". Doesn't this apply to all creative disciplines and any creative pursuit? What's special about the process of writing?

Writers Curse has its roots in the fact writing a novel can have real negative consequences (it takes ages, massive sacrifices are needed, and very unlikely to make anything substantial etc.) And yet, such people can have an obsession to write. Honestly I met so many crazy obsessed writers over the years.

If you have money then it would be great fun. But it's a huge burden if not.

Note: you will hear about some novels that take only X weeks and make a ton of money. e.g. twilight. But most writers I ever met the average was around 5-7 years for the first book. If you're taking X weeks, the odds are it will be pretty shit unless it's very autobiographical. I loved dhamma bums by Jack Kerouac for example and I think he smashed that out in about 3 months.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#75

Post by [deleted] »

SunlightEdge wrote: post #74
systemvoltage wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am slightly bothered by terms such as "Writer's Curse" and "Writer's Block". Doesn't this apply to all creative disciplines and any creative pursuit? What's special about the process of writing?

Writers Curse has its roots in the fact writing a novel can have real negative consequences (it takes ages, massive sacrifices are needed, and very unlikely to make anything substantial etc.) And yet, such people can have an obsession to write. Honestly I met so many crazy obsessed writers over the years. If you have money then it would be great fun. But it's a huge burden if not. Note: you will hear about some novel…

[deleted]

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#76

Post by anchpop »

SunlightEdge wrote: post #73
haolez wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The review that you got there was pretty cool! The reader was actually surprised by the innovative way that you've put together your narrative :)

Thank you ^^ Well... If you enjoy reading maybe give my novel a go :) You do need a Kindle though /wouldn't recommend reading on a phone. But no hassles. Cheers

I was about to pick it up before I read this comment, any particular reason you don't recommend reading it a phone? that's generally the main way I read books so I was disappointed

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#77

Post by Aerroon »

xivzgrev wrote: post #71
SunlightEdge wrote: post #31

Unfortunately most writers of fiction make next to nothing too. Writers often are not happy writing either (unlike painters and video artists who seem to have a whale of a time). Sadly I toiled for 8 years on a novel (while working a day job). It was a massive effort. It might be hard for people to understand but I felt I had to write it (i.e. writers curse). I wish I had spent all that time on studying programming e…

I can relate a bit. I also wrote a book that quickly faded into obscurity. The biggest learning I had was I had no audience. I needed to build that first with blog posts or what not, THEN write the book. I’m surprised that’s not covered here in this article

Writing a book is like creating anything else. Whether you're writing a book, making music, producing goods or offering services, people need to actually try what you've made. This is why "advertising" is so important. Not necessarily traditional advertising, but some form of getting the word out about your amazing creation.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#78

Post by SunlightEdge »

anchpop wrote: post #76
SunlightEdge wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you ^^ Well... If you enjoy reading maybe give my novel a go :) You do need a Kindle though /wouldn't recommend reading on a phone. But no hassles. Cheers

I was about to pick it up before I read this comment, any particular reason you don't recommend reading it a phone? that's generally the main way I read books so I was disappointed

Oh. Well you can try on the phone I guess. If thats how you normally read stuff.

I might be picky, but I just prefer kindle for longer stuff. IPads and tablets might be good too.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#79

Post by chipotle_coyote »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #56
Multiplayer wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it makes sense. He's saying that if you get a 15% royalty, vs the 100% royalty minus costs of self publishing, you need to sell 5x more books via the publisher. It's oddly worded, but the math roughly works depending on your self publishing costs.

It's very poorly worded. And if not wrong, then certainly very unclear. The math... depends. Not all publishers offer advances, and those that do offer advances with different strategies. Here is one strategy: a commissioning editor uses a sales modelling system to estimate the maximum possible advance against likely sales. At larger publishers, you can be sure the editor has a very good idea what the likely sales wi…

Signing a contract with an advance that turns out to be all you get paid for the book is not at all "really a work for hire contract" -- you could say it turns out to really be a flat fee contract, but that's not the same thing. A "work for hire" contract has to do with who owns the copyright, not the payment structure. If your publisher gives you a $10,000 advance on your book and you don't earn enough royalties to break the $10K mark, the book is still yours. (And there are work for hire contracts that pay royalties rather than flat fees!)

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#80

Post by perlgeek »

Step 1: sell 10k copies of your book through self-publishing.

Step 0: already be successful at marketing or be well-known.

There are certainly some valid points, but his solution pre-supposes that you already know your marketing.

So the actual steps would be:

* consistently produce good content for several years, build an audience (and an email list, as quaint as it sounds)

* write a book, self-publish it

* promote the out of it

* THEN try to get a publisher on board

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