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Nobody is joining Google's FLoC

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Re: Nobody is joining Google's FLoC

#181

Post by cratermoon »

cortesoft wrote: post #141
cratermoon wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You: Here's a cute picture of my cat, I'll post it on Instagram for my friends Instagram: cool! We're showing this to all your friends. BTW it costs us money to do this but don't worry, we don't charge you, we just show some ads to your friends. You: Hey, my kitten is really popular, a lot of people are liking it. Instagram: High five! You're popular. We ended up making a lot more money from selling ads than it cost…

Your cut is the free hosting and services... and both you and Instagram are subsidizing the people who use the service and don't generate many views.

[flagged]

Re: Nobody is joining Google's FLoC

#182

Post by jlaurend »

naikrovek wrote: post #149
shp0ngle wrote: post #139

People say how they hate surveillance tech, but at the end of the day, it pays half of the bills on this website. Most probably, there is Google Analytics and Facebook pixel on the very site you are building right now. So all these horribly, horribly outraged comments ring kind of hollow to me. I mean look at how many trackers are on The Verge site itself. Yeah FLoC is horrible. I hope it dies in a fire. It's just, p…

> people that build websites want tracking. And it works. Retargeting works, banners work. do they? I've never once bought anything because and ad made me aware of it, or because an ad convinced me I needed it. not once. has anyone? I'm sure someone has, but how many? I would not be surprised if studies were done that computed a purchase rate overall for all the ads people see or hear in their lives, that the number…

Yes, retargeting and tracking is extremely effective.

You've fallen into what I'm gonna call the "HN fallacy".

- I would never click on an ad, therefore no one clicks on ads.

- I don't have a need for a better file syncing UX, therefore no one would ever use Dropbox.

- I don't see the point in crypto, therefore no one would ever use Coinbase.

Specifically, let's say you've seen 100,000 ads in your lifetime and literally zero have had any impact on you, much less driven you to click through and purchase immediately. It's reasonable for you to question the utility of these ads.

There are, however, entire populations of users whose behavior is vastly different from yours. They may be very willing to click through an ad to purchase.

A good marketer will only target their ads at the people most likely to purchase (i.e. not you). This puts you on a negative feedback cycle where you only get ads from companies that are spray-and-praying or too unsophisticated to target their ads more specifically.

Re: Nobody is joining Google's FLoC

#183

Post by GekkePrutser »

Hnrobert42 wrote: post #144
_abox wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you get users into your walled garden though? I just walk away when I encounter a paywall and I'm sure most people do.

Examples of walled gardens that many people use are Instagram, FB, even Reddit to some extent which hamstring their mobile sites and push you to an app.

Good point.

I couldn't get out of all these either but I keep them strictly separated in Firefox tab containers. I think it works because Facebook always suggests friends to me whom I don't know at all, and its ads have no relevance to me (only to the 1 or 2 topics I use FB for).

Re: Nobody is joining Google's FLoC

#184

Post by feoren »

jlaurend wrote: post #182
naikrovek wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> people that build websites want tracking. And it works. Retargeting works, banners work. do they? I've never once bought anything because and ad made me aware of it, or because an ad convinced me I needed it. not once. has anyone? I'm sure someone has, but how many? I would not be surprised if studies were done that computed a purchase rate overall for all the ads people see or hear in their lives, that the number…

Yes, retargeting and tracking is extremely effective. You've fallen into what I'm gonna call the "HN fallacy". - I would never click on an ad, therefore no one clicks on ads. - I don't have a need for a better file syncing UX, therefore no one would ever use Dropbox. - I don't see the point in crypto, therefore no one would ever use Coinbase. Specifically, let's say you've seen 100,000 ads in your lifetime and litera…

I've been told this my entire life. People make statements like "everyone does X" and I say "really? I have literally never done X in my life and I know many people who say the exact same thing; in fact I'm not sure I've ever met anyone who does X" and the response is "yes, but you're different from everyone else. You and everyone you know are not like most people!" I find it extremely unconvincing.

Re: Nobody is joining Google's FLoC

#185

Post by phyzome »

blacktriangle wrote: post #177
phyzome wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what's Firefox, chopped liver?

Isn't it? Marketshare is cratering, it's not keeping up with Chromium and Safari, and the Mozilla foundation is the poster child for dysfunctional organizations. Thank god it looks like Rust has escape from Mozilla and how has a nice support network of its own. Do you honestly see any signs of Firefox's situation getting better and not continuing its free fall?

You claimed it was not an alternative. But it is an alternative; I use it all day every day at work and at home, and I have for years. It's obviously working.

Market share has nothing to do with whether something is an option.

Re: Nobody is joining Google's FLoC

#186

Post by naikrovek »

busymom0 wrote: post #154
naikrovek wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> people that build websites want tracking. And it works. Retargeting works, banners work. do they? I've never once bought anything because and ad made me aware of it, or because an ad convinced me I needed it. not once. has anyone? I'm sure someone has, but how many? I would not be surprised if studies were done that computed a purchase rate overall for all the ads people see or hear in their lives, that the number…

One thing to note is that the purpose of ads might not just be to get you to directly click on it and buy something. It might also be to make you remember the brand name so the next time you think of lets say baby diapers, you remember "Huggies" because they are the most advertised ones even though there are better and cheaper alternatives. As for how impactful the ads are - you don't need a study. Simply run an ad a…

> to make you remember the brand name [later, while not viewing any ad.]

maybe, but that seems so untraceable that it wouldn't be worth the effort to even think about. but, ad people definitely think differently than I do, so who knows what they think about every day.

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