Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

nysfocus.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

321–330 of 578 posts

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#321

Post by beachy »

whywhywhywhy wrote: post #311
bransonf wrote: post #94

It’s a simple equation: So long as there is more money in mining BTC than there is cost in energy to mine it, mining will proceed. No entity in the world can control the price of crypto. But, we can and already do regulate energy production. I think we need a carbon tax, that is specifically a financial disincentive towards any means of energy production that directly pollutes the atmosphere. Seriously, what are the…

> I think we need a carbon tax I get the concerns for the carbon issue of Bitcoin but I don't see why the solution should be governments profiting more from it.

Carbon tax is unusual in that it has a major benefit simply by suppressing consumption.

If an alien civilization invaded earth and imposed a carbon tax, and took all of the proceeds back to their own planet, then we would still be better off.

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#322

Post by jariel »

bb88 wrote: post #189
ayngg wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me it seems like Bitcoin (and other pow cryptocurrencies) are almost like the climate change scapegoat for a number of social and economic issues that have seemingly come to a head recently to facilitate their rise. People mine because it is expensive, it isn't the other way around, so the real questions we should be asking in good faith are things like "Why it is profitable in the first place?" and I think it is…

> People mine because it is expensive, it isn't the other way around, so the real questions we should be asking in good faith are things like "Why it is profitable in the first place?" FOMO, mining lotteries, and the guise of financial innovation are typical cover stories here. But all stocks and other publicly traded investments are basically making a bet that others will buy in after you do, raising the price highe…

"Most stock owners hope this very thing, t"

Stocks imply ownership of assets.

Sure, in terms of 'hoping that someone willy buy' is similar to BTC, but the valuation is completely different.

A stock is valued based on the performance of it's actual profit generation.

BTC is just a made up number. It's what people think the crowd will buy it for. Granted, this mechanism itself can be useful in some scenarios, but BTC itself isn't useful, at least not right now.

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#323

Post by batirch »

politician wrote: post #289
birracerveza wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>What probably should happen is to make converting from any cryptocurrency to major world currencies a crime. I have a better idea, let's make everything that causes pollution a crime. Bought a plastic water bottle? Straight to jail. Refueled your car? Yep, jail. You used your heater? Believe it or not, jail. I'm sure we'll live in a pollution free utopia in no time. Thank you for your insightful contribution. This i…

Breathing? Right to jail.

Reminds of Haven episode S1 of Star Trek Next Gen. Any crime is punishable by death. So there won't be any more crime.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfqa596xxbc

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#326

Post by ganafagol »

ayngg wrote: post #159
bransonf wrote: post #94

It’s a simple equation: So long as there is more money in mining BTC than there is cost in energy to mine it, mining will proceed. No entity in the world can control the price of crypto. But, we can and already do regulate energy production. I think we need a carbon tax, that is specifically a financial disincentive towards any means of energy production that directly pollutes the atmosphere. Seriously, what are the…

To me it seems like Bitcoin (and other pow cryptocurrencies) are almost like the climate change scapegoat for a number of social and economic issues that have seemingly come to a head recently to facilitate their rise. People mine because it is expensive, it isn't the other way around, so the real questions we should be asking in good faith are things like "Why it is profitable in the first place?" and I think it is…

How is this related to the comment you replied to? It was about pollution and introduction of a carbon tax.

As long as we are having this kind of "discussion" I can see why fantasies about leaving earth and colonizing space are popular.

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#327

Post by [deleted] »

SwimSwimHungry wrote: post #91
o_p wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not BTC miners fault that energy is priced incorrectly. We shouldnt waste any energy into powering the armies of the world, lets just not fight, right? But here we are.

I'm not fighting here. Your comment came off as dismissive to some growing and legitimate concerns. And don't forget. Bitcoin is not replacing these other institutions that need energy. Stop handwaving away the problem, because it's inconvenient for you to hear.

[deleted]

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#328

Post by itsyaboi »

birracerveza wrote: post #272
SwimSwimHungry wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard to do this when you can have other countries with much looser regulations allow Bitcoin miners run rampant. What probably should happen is to make converting from any cryptocurrency to major world currencies a crime. I have no delusions that this will halt activity in this sector entirely, but it will make it reasonably difficult to make any substantial money this way without raising some serious eyebrows.

>What probably should happen is to make converting from any cryptocurrency to major world currencies a crime. I have a better idea, let's make everything that causes pollution a crime. Bought a plastic water bottle? Straight to jail. Refueled your car? Yep, jail. You used your heater? Believe it or not, jail. I'm sure we'll live in a pollution free utopia in no time. Thank you for your insightful contribution. This i…

You joke, but this is the exact thought process behind gun-free zones.

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#329

Post by rhn_mk1 »

ganafagol wrote: post #326
ayngg wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me it seems like Bitcoin (and other pow cryptocurrencies) are almost like the climate change scapegoat for a number of social and economic issues that have seemingly come to a head recently to facilitate their rise. People mine because it is expensive, it isn't the other way around, so the real questions we should be asking in good faith are things like "Why it is profitable in the first place?" and I think it is…

How is this related to the comment you replied to? It was about pollution and introduction of a carbon tax. As long as we are having this kind of "discussion" I can see why fantasies about leaving earth and colonizing space are popular.

The parent highlighted that carbon tax may do little to nothing to stop proof-of-work cryptocurrencies. The relevant quote is:

> People mine because it is expensive, it isn't the other way around, so the real questions we should be asking in good faith are things like "Why it is profitable in the first place?"

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#330

Post by _huayra_ »

jariel wrote: post #322
bb88 wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People mine because it is expensive, it isn't the other way around, so the real questions we should be asking in good faith are things like "Why it is profitable in the first place?" FOMO, mining lotteries, and the guise of financial innovation are typical cover stories here. But all stocks and other publicly traded investments are basically making a bet that others will buy in after you do, raising the price highe…

"Most stock owners hope this very thing, t" Stocks imply ownership of assets. Sure, in terms of 'hoping that someone willy buy' is similar to BTC, but the valuation is completely different. A stock is valued based on the performance of it's actual profit generation. BTC is just a made up number. It's what people think the crowd will buy it for. Granted, this mechanism itself can be useful in some scenarios, but BTC i…

I think people with BTC FOMO forget that it was always some sort of "hype Ponzi scheme". Back in 2011, I worked in an office that had one guy who was really into BTC. Looking back now, everyone thinks "wow he was such a genius to get in so early", but back then it was not profitable to mine, even if the difficulty was far lower. We'd constantly roast this coworker over his seemingly loony efforts to put solar on his house to cover the cost of mining neglecting to consider the solar panels would (in our opinions back then) put him in the red for a long time. (good on him for at least going green with it). I must admit I'm quite jealous of his insistence despite us roasting him (he's probably a multimillionaire now on BTC), but anyone who says "Oh yeah I could totally tell that BTC would take off in 2011" is being disingenuous at best.

Unlike stocks which imply ownership of assets of a company, BTC is a pure hype machine, with the most hype given out by people who are already bought in.

If any product or service has ONLY people who use it hyping it up (e.g. BTC, and especially NFTs!) or only people who are NOT using it hyping it up (e.g. the myriad get-rich-quick schemes about some drop-shipping Amazon thing, real estate, or "hOw To BE aN eNTrePreNeUR" in a vague sense of the term (whatever the Gary V & friends stuff is); all those guys make money not by doing what they're telling you to do but by telling you what to do...), it's usually a bad sign.

Post reply on HN