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Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

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Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#601

As a hiring manager, the things that stand out to me in your post: - You said you quit a job at EA, quit a job at IBM, dropped out of college your freshman year. You may have valid reasons for leaving each of these, but you have to see this from the manager's perspective: You had 3 different great opportunities that all came to a dead end at the beginning of your career. You need an alternate narrative. - You talk ab…

That's spot on from the advice. I'll add that OP — Your biggest issue seems to be extremely high intelligence, paired with a lack of empathy and social functioning, which created a self-expectation of massive grandiosity. But you keep failing to deliver on it because you can't get your highly powered brain on the streets, leading in self-pity and depression. Not good, but salvageable. How do I know? My life story rea…

Job interview question: „What is your biggest weakness“ - „Extremely high intelligence paired with a lack of empathy“.

How does „extremely high intelligence“ lead to multiple college dropouts? For the OP it was a lack of money to pay US study fees. I doubt that several other points you mention (like „don’t be the one who makes the snarkiest comment“) are comparable to OPs experience.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#602

Chances are you somehow act really creepy, which you do not see yourself. Ask a friend for a mock interview. Record it and watch later. Don't have a friend? Hire someone. A friend cannot do mock interviews? Hand them a list of 10 questions that you remember from all those previous attempts and tell them to read it in solemn voice. Nowadays the interviews are remote. Let a friend observe your interview and then ask th…

> Ask a friend Or ask not-a-friend. A random person who is skilled in interviewing and doesn't have a personal relationship with you may give you more true answers.

Such persons could be available on upwork or fiverr, and thus quite cheap.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#603

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's spot on from the advice. I'll add that OP — Your biggest issue seems to be extremely high intelligence, paired with a lack of empathy and social functioning, which created a self-expectation of massive grandiosity. But you keep failing to deliver on it because you can't get your highly powered brain on the streets, leading in self-pity and depression. Not good, but salvageable. How do I know? My life story rea…

I too suffer from an extremely high intelligence.

I would have replaced intelligence and ambition with confidence. I think it reads better. Theres no way we can measure the intelligence of people by the fact they dropped out of college or got a job and then left it. Theres no positive signals here, just negative or neutral.

I suspect people call it intelligence when they see themselves in the behaviour. Since we all think we're above average https://priceonomics.com/why-do-we-all-think-were-above-aver...

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#604
Most companies don't want trouble and don't want low level employees to give advice how to improve something. By doing this, you make the people above you look bad and they don't want that even if what you say is correct and helpful. Basically if you find a new job, do only what is required from you, don't poke around, don't try to find vulnerabilities, don't spy on co-workers, don't report anyone (unless they are breaking the law and put someone else in danger).

Maybe you believe in those stories from a janitor to an executive after some magic moment, but in the real life this doesn't happen. There are no shortcuts. You should consider that you may also be on the spectrum and you simply got wrong how social interactions work - if you cannot afford a therapist, you could look around for books on the topic. Unfortunately can't think of any now, apart from maybe "Look me in the eye" by John Elder Robison

Then the ultimate way to get a job when you are unemployable is to start a company. I know this sounds stupid when you are on the brink of being homeless, but you could consider getting just any job and start a project in your spare time. If you come up with something that excites you and make it work, you'll also have a good resume material that could help with getting a job or an investor.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#605
I suspect this will never be read, but what the heck...

I sincerely wish you luck.

I reckon there’s a lot that hasn’t been said, possibly because you are personally unaware.

I can relate. I have had difficulty in personal relationships for most of my life, and learning to get past this was a long, humbling process.

Today’s hiring system is pretty messed up. I should know. I gave up looking some time ago, because the experience has become more akin to a college hazing, than a serious professional evaluation. I have no interest in proving to anyone that I’m willing to abase myself (because I’m not). If that is required, then I won’t waste anyone’s time.

But I’m extremely fortunate. I can afford to remain aloof. That’s a rare privilege.

Credit history is now something that almost every job looks at; especially at large companies. It’s pretty routine to review that. Most HR departments have contracts with vetting companies, and credit history is “low-hanging fruit.” These companies will also do things like check criminal history (even just arrest or misdemeanor convictions), follow up educational claims (I remember a guy getting fired, nearly a year into his employment, because he Photoshopped his degree), and will sometimes also trawl social media.

A criminal history or bad credit is not a showstopper, but it requires a clear, honest, humble approach; along with self-exposure. Assume they’ll find out. I knew a chap that did four felony bids upstate, and ended up working as a network admin for the DOE. Psych history is easier to hide, because HIPAA, but we need to address the issue, or it will be obvious. Even so, being honest and forthright can be helpful. If we have Tourette’s Syndrome, it will usually be immediately apparent, so it’s not a good idea to try to hide it, or get combative, when asked about it. Red flags make people nervous. Nervous people can ask awkward, ignorant questions. Being kind and understanding won’t hurt. We can decide that we don’t want to work with this person, but we don’t need to salt the earth behind us.

High-security corporations and TLAs will break out the proctoscope. There’s a form for applying to sensitive government agencies, that is over 100 pages long. They may interview your ex, so be nice to her/him/them.

I’m very honest. I don’t hide a thing. This has not always been helpful, but it’s also who I am. I have no interest in working with folks unwilling to accept me as I am.

I do know that most US states (from your post, I assume you are in the US, and that you are a US citizen) have agencies that help people to find work; often through coaching and résumé assistance. I live in New York, which is fairly good for that.

A follow-up mentioned having a portfolio. We can work on open-source projects, and build up portfolios. I have a pretty massive one.

We can also network. Develop positive relationships with anyone we can. Even low-level contacts in companies can be enormously helpful. Many corporations pay “spiffs” to employees, for recommending prospects. Be friendly, kind, open, and a team player. It pays great dividends.

Working in open-source project teams is a great way to do that. It also gives us a portfolio. Volunteer work is great. Many NPOs suffer a lack of tech talent. They would be grateful for any help, and you can establish great relationships, that way. Be careful, however, who you work with. If you work with United Way, local food banks, or housing assistance orgs, that is good. Work with more...intense organizations (I won’t list any) can be an issue, though.

There’s a lot more I could say, but I tend to prolix (obv). I suspect that stuff you did not mention is your albatross, and I’d suggest doing a fearless and searching personal inventory. Be brutally honest with yourself. Shine a klieg lamp on your personal aspect, personality, and demeanor. Ask for help. Be humble. It sounds like you have no choice.

Be prepared to address personal demons. It can be terrifying, but well worth it.

Good luck, and godspeed.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#607
post #588

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was my initial reaction, but the "your" is actually correct there: > Your applying to those companies with 0 experience or college degree is unrealistic. The clause "applying to..." is possessed by "your".

Agree, both "you're" and "your" are correct with different perspectives.

Nope, only "your" is correct in this case. "You're" would require a slight rewording, something like:

> You're applying to those companies with 0 experience or college degree, which is unrealistic.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#609

I'm a software engineer that runs a technical recruiting company. I worked at Microsoft and Netflix for a decade. Email me at robert at facet dot net. I will interview you and tell you why you're not getting hired.

I went ahead and signed myself up to your website. The application made me feel like I wasn't supposed to, considering I've never done any of the things it asked if I did, and am just a lowly CS student who doesn't even have a great GPA, and is about to graduate jobless... so I figured I'd take a shot. Very nice signup process. Smooth as butter.

Completely understand if you can't help me, but would love some feedback on my resume at least.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#610
Candidly: 1. The kind of companies you are applying to (apart from DoE and I guess Dell) are literally the "best" places in the world to work. You are going up against people with objectively much much better qualifications and experience than you. Aim lower. Life is tough and sometimes certain paths are just shut off for you, permanently. You can point to the one person who is killing it at Google after working as a grocery bagger for 20 years. Thats not going to be you, statistically speaking.

2. You do not seem genuinely interested in any company. You come across like that college student who applies to all the top companies as....they're the top companies. Find what you want to do and apply to do that, no matter where and in what junior position. Look I do not know you but I'd bet a lot of money you took the amazon gig just to say you work at Amazon.

3. You do not seem genuinely interested in the day-to-day job you are going for. Again, if you did, I do not see why you are not applying to do that job at...a local high school, if needed

4. Intern in the role you want. Do it for free for a charity (volunteer). Blog about it. Make YT vids about it. Why do you think speaking to an SVP would even matter? The chances they will give you a shot are slim to none. What did you even say to them? Give me job. I hack?

5. Personally, I appreciate your "spoofing" antics. It shows a bit of daring and networking. I don't think its creepy IMO.

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