I'm a software engineer that runs a technical recruiting company. I worked at Microsoft and Netflix for a decade. Email me at robert at facet dot net. I will interview you and tell you why you're not getting hired.
Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?
561–570 of 875 posts
Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?
#562Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's a good comment with the right instinct but for the wrong reasons. The biggest red flag is struggling with personal finance. You can't get jobs like the ones he wants if you live beyond your means and constantly land in hot water with money because people who are like that are at risk of turning to evil to make ends meet.
He just spent a year without any steady source of income, should't his saving run out at one point ?
Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?
#563Brutally candid advice? You sound like a creep. Am I reading it right here, you spoofed your number to talk to executives? In the best case, they'll assume you're a pen-tester; but more likely, you're blacklisted from those companies now. I wish there was, like, short and simple advice that I could give you to not be a creep. I just tried to google that, and I'm not finding a good clear resource. Like most social ski…
I have to admit I snorted after reading your comment and scrolled back up to notice he's using an FSF email address. Apple, tree, etc.
Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?
#564Earlier quoted context omitted.
> but do not care for them (which would be sociopathic) No, disliking social norms is not sociopathic. The critical piece of being sociopathic is a lack of conscience.
That's not true. A sociopath knows that he's doing something wrong and chooses not to regret it. A psychopath otoh has a low neural activity in the area of the brain usually associated with empathy. The main point being that being a sociopath is learned behavior. Cf. https://youtu.be/6dv8zJiggBs (I agree that disliking norms are not sociopathic. The norms might be sociopathic.) (Also: I'm not an expert, I could well…
Both sociopath and psychopath are terms stemming from the early 20th century, where our main concern was to lable people ASAP and prescribe them a "cure".
No professional psychology authority uses either of those terms today. Instead, you get ranked on the Antisocial personality disorder spectrum. This has several advantages, like having an actual statistical body of research behind it etc.
So your random YouTube video might not be wrong in a sense, but more like someone defining what "miasma" or "bloodletting" is: Interesting, but essentially just a talk about medieval medicine.
I would urge you to refrain from (especially) diagnosing people based on public wisdom on psychology.
Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?
#565Your post provides a recruiter any number of reasons not to hire you. In addition to providing a personal history of failure and excuses, you're airing the dirty laundry of the companies you did work for. Your misgivings with these may or may not be legitimate, however what recruiter wants their name attached to you the next time you feel like airing your grievances with the last company to lay you off? > "I tried co…
> If you can't get through this thread without discussing your mental health problems that's a serious red flag. That's unfair. Most of the mental health related comments are in direct response to someone else bringing it up.
The title of the post pins down the problem (OP describes themselves as "unhireable"), but in the post it is everybodies fault but their own and they fail to disclose why they think from the perspecitve of a company they are unhireable. I don't see any issue with making mistakes. But not learning from them to protect a mythical image you painted of yourself and your abilities is not only a problem but also a wasted chance that will come back to haunt you till you address it.
If I would be in the position of having spoofed a phone number to call a superior and loose a job, I would be ashamed or at least re-examine the state of mind and perspective that lead me to the dubious conclusion that this would be a good idea. The fact that OP seems to file that under "daring, but could have worked" rather than "this was totally inappropriate, how could I have ever thought this would be??" is what promts those mental health related comments.
What OP needs to get hireable is a reality check that leads to a lasting change of mind. This can be incredibly hard and painful, but if OP is clever they will know that this needs to be addressed and go through with it. The worst thing OP can do now, is gloss over that particular aspect of this thread and not address the discrepancy between their self image and what their words, decisions and actions communicate. The worst thing so to speak is to continue lying to themselves.
Know thyself and all that.
Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?
#566Earlier quoted context omitted.
Interesting. I'm curious: roughly how often did the candidate promise they'd take your feedback constructively, calmly and then argue with you anyway? (I'd hope it would be close to 0, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was much higher.)
I'm a recruiter and candidates argue 95% of the time. Maybe higher. I only give feedback in very, very selective situations and even then I almost always regret it due to the response. Most people are not calm, rational, dispassionate receptors of critical feedback... especially when there is money and ego at stake.
Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?
#567Earlier quoted context omitted.
Desperate is what the primary person feels. Creeped out is what the receiving person feels. When does desperate become creepy? Everyone has a different definition. If I was an exec on the receiving end, I'd definitely be put off by all of this.
Personally, I can feel someone's desperation and it feels a lot different to me than when someone is being socially awkward or a creep. But as someone who's done hiring before they are all pretty big put offs (maybe socially awkward isn't bad as long as it not a interaction heavy role).
Well, isn't it possible for a person to be desperate and still creep out others? Or even more, as desperation leads to more extreme behavior.
Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?
#568From the sounds of things you don't sound unhireable as you've had several jobs. You just quit them for perhaps bad reasons? Even in a situation where I have a good social safety net I wouldn't quit a job I needed unless I had something else lined up.
> I need a job with decent health/dental insurance. Medicaid is useless. I might be homeless soon.
Pragmatically you need to deal with these material needs first. It's going to be exponentially harder to reach for the jobs you think you deserve if you aren't able to take care of your physical needs properly. I really sympathize here though, the healthcare system is the US is a joke.
Practically I think you need to make a couple of plans:
1) Short-term: How to stabilize your own life so you meet your living needs. You as you say you need a steady job and some level of health coverage. Go through the usual things of making sure your applications match the roles and so on.
2) Long-term: You sound like you want an entry level software engineering or cyber-security role in a high status company. You need to put down a realistic assessment of where you are and a realistic plan of how to get there. This probably requires swallowing a bit of pride and admitting to your current faults.
Ideally for both bits try and find someone you trust and will listen to who you can give you advice based on an unvarnished account of where you are at now. Reading between the lines it sounds like you need a bit of a reality check but that's obviously hard to do without knowing more about you.
Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?
#569Your post provides a recruiter any number of reasons not to hire you. In addition to providing a personal history of failure and excuses, you're airing the dirty laundry of the companies you did work for. Your misgivings with these may or may not be legitimate, however what recruiter wants their name attached to you the next time you feel like airing your grievances with the last company to lay you off? > "I tried co…
> Your writing is terrible, and unprofessional. If you can't get through this thread without discussing your mental health problems that's a serious red flag. Are you saying that in "professional" situations (job applications, or even asking for advice on HN), you need to hide your struggles and present an image of a flawless worker who handles all situations in stride, even though you can't live up to it because of…
Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?
#570Earlier quoted context omitted.
I just want to say that this was a kind, detailed, and thoughtful response -- beneficial to the OP, no doubt, but also probably to others. It was nice to be reminded that sometimes the Internet doesn't suck. Thanks for taking the time to write that reply.
It's a good comment with the right instinct but for the wrong reasons. The biggest red flag is struggling with personal finance. You can't get jobs like the ones he wants if you live beyond your means and constantly land in hot water with money because people who are like that are at risk of turning to evil to make ends meet.
To turn this into an advice for people interviewing without a safety net: get a safety net. It can be a job that is easy to get, a rent that is easy to pay, just make sure that you can live by that situation indefinitely. You need to leap from there. You need to be able to turn down job offers to be able to negotiate.