Live data from Hacker News

Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

nysfocus.com

251–260 of 578 posts

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#251
post #5

A simple move that would ban selling fossil power plants for cryptocurrencies mining purpose BUT allowing to do so for the carbon-neutral energy would be a win-win for both sides and will help the transition from carbon-heavy energy.

Simpler: ban banks and credit card companies from dealing with anything related to cryptocurrency

Heavy-handed control of fiat will only strengthen peoples' desire for an alternative.

What you really want instead is a non-mined cryptocurrency.

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#253
post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me it seems like Bitcoin (and other pow cryptocurrencies) are almost like the climate change scapegoat for a number of social and economic issues that have seemingly come to a head recently to facilitate their rise. People mine because it is expensive, it isn't the other way around, so the real questions we should be asking in good faith are things like "Why it is profitable in the first place?" and I think it is…

Yes. Cryptocurrencies are used because they're the only market that hasn't yet been regulated to death. People come to Bitcoin for 2 reasons, mainly: 1. It's a practical way to store value without the government destroying it by monetary emission. 2. People are free to speculate. The solution to the first point is that governments should stop pulling the rug from under people's feet. Monetary emission should be predi…

Doesn't that make it a target for regulation, at which point it's value is likely to go down?

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#254

It’s a simple equation: So long as there is more money in mining BTC than there is cost in energy to mine it, mining will proceed. No entity in the world can control the price of crypto. But, we can and already do regulate energy production. I think we need a carbon tax, that is specifically a financial disincentive towards any means of energy production that directly pollutes the atmosphere. Seriously, what are the…

The growth in supply would not slow - in Bitcoin every two weeks you have a rebalancing of difficulty, so if miners have less hashing power the difficulty of producing each block gets lowered to keep the supply stable.

Sure, but energy usage still goes down. Revenue from block rewards is limited. Costs can’t exceed revenue or unprofitable miners will drop out. More money spent on one expense (the carbon tax) would mean less can be spent on the electricity itself.

Or more likely they’re outcompeted by anyone who doesn’t have to pay the tax, such as miners using green energy or in a jurisdiction without the tax.

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#256
post #159

It’s a simple equation: So long as there is more money in mining BTC than there is cost in energy to mine it, mining will proceed. No entity in the world can control the price of crypto. But, we can and already do regulate energy production. I think we need a carbon tax, that is specifically a financial disincentive towards any means of energy production that directly pollutes the atmosphere. Seriously, what are the…

To me it seems like Bitcoin (and other pow cryptocurrencies) are almost like the climate change scapegoat for a number of social and economic issues that have seemingly come to a head recently to facilitate their rise. People mine because it is expensive, it isn't the other way around, so the real questions we should be asking in good faith are things like "Why it is profitable in the first place?" and I think it is…

> why have the greater financial markets become so wonky, why has the behavior of investors changed so radically

Since the global saving glut (1), the best question to ask of crazy asset valuations is not "does it reflect the fundamental value?", but "does the money have anywhere else to go?"

(1) - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_saving_glut

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#257

It’s a simple equation: So long as there is more money in mining BTC than there is cost in energy to mine it, mining will proceed. No entity in the world can control the price of crypto. But, we can and already do regulate energy production. I think we need a carbon tax, that is specifically a financial disincentive towards any means of energy production that directly pollutes the atmosphere. Seriously, what are the…

> No entity in the world can control the price of crypto.

Paolo Ardoino would like a word with you.

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's the problem with this sentiment. Bitcoin isn't replacing anything. Not pre-existing fiat currency, not banks, nothing. Bitcoin only adds to the problem at an alarming rate. Bitcoin is certainly not a scapegoat. It's a massive problem and, largely, a symptom of human greed that must be put in check.

What a weird metric. The international space station isn't replacing anything, i still think its valuable.

It has replaced things. You are just ignorant to it.

https://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/station/research/news/15_...

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#259

It’s a simple equation: So long as there is more money in mining BTC than there is cost in energy to mine it, mining will proceed. No entity in the world can control the price of crypto. But, we can and already do regulate energy production. I think we need a carbon tax, that is specifically a financial disincentive towards any means of energy production that directly pollutes the atmosphere. Seriously, what are the…

A carbon tax would be great, but I don’t know why you think governments couldn’t significantly discourage holding cryptocurrency? A wealth tax on proof-of-work currencies would discourage legitimate businesses (that don’t cheat on taxes) from holding them.

Well that's fine, no legitimate businesses hold them. Seriously. Your suppliers are paid in dollars, your tax burden is in dollars based on the conversion price on receipt. To hold them on receipt is wildly irresponsible speculation, as a business.

Re: Bitcoin miners are buying power plants

#260
This might be a good thing. There are a few responses possible:

1. Do nothing, public gets angry.

2. Make bitcoin, or its mining, illegal. However, what is the criteria? All blockchains? Should google be illegal too? Both are just a digital product that the public wants.

3. Tax CO2 production by data centers, that might have a chance it can be coordinated broadly between nations, there is enough money there to tax, and bitcoin adds some urgency.

While doubtful CO2 can be taxed globally, without coordination, big companies play governments against each other.

Post reply on HN