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Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

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Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who sometimes struggles with social stuff, join a club has never been useful advice for me. Its never worked out well, i'm not sure where y'all live where there are actually interesting clubs, and they're pretty awkward environments generally imo. I've had better luck with do something with a more structured environment. E.g. take an in person class (something not work related. Learn sign language or somet…

I think it used to be difficult to find decent clubs outside of school, but sites like meetup have tons of different groups. Language meetups are particularly plentiful. They are different from a class, but they are always open to people of various levels.

Honestly, i found clubs to be uncomfortable social interactions, even in university (actually, even in high school, and grade school). Maybe they're just not for me. Anyhow i found other ways to fulfil my social needs.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#322
My advice is make sure you have the programming fundamentals. Online courses are available - MIT offers great classes and free too. Taking some kind of accelerator or bootcamp might work for you too.

Supplement learning with doing projects. Create some things you want to play around with. I found implementing data structures was a good project while learning programming because it simultaneously helped familiarize me with the data structures and with learning programming. Add on some projects in the areas you're interested in. Chat app, video game, website, whatever. I also suggest reading official documentation for a language or library instead of a book on the subject. The official docs, if good, are a lot more dense and valuable. I taught myself python just by reading their official docs and it was the easiest experience I've ever had learning a language.

As you get ready for the interview I would watch YouTube videos that take you through mock interviews. Listen to questions, pause the videos, give your answers, then listen to their analysis. You don't always need to agree with these videos, but it's good stuff to think about.

I also highly recommend leetcode. I know some people look down on it but software interviews often have a component that is basically a leetcode question. I suggest solving 2-300 problems, mostly medium or hard, and making sure you can solve any medium or easy question, and explain it as you go, in under half an hour. If you get stuck YouTube is a good resource to see people explain leetcode problems.

I have also found it helpful to write a little log as you're learning or working on a side project. I take notes of major failures and ask, and then explain in writing, why that happened and how I can prevent it in the future. When you find yourself writing multiple entries in the log with the same explanation, you know you've found a costly error you need to correct!

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This kind of safe advice isn't very helpful for someone who is hustling IMO. Maybe it is useful for someone who's going to become a principal engineer at a large corporate. The parent commenter would be well suited to work at a startup. Unfortunately, startups have also been infected by the corporate virus. In a country that's stagnating, such risk averse behavior makes sense, because there is no reward for taking on…

That's weird, where did you get the sense that op is "hustling" (whatever that means)? They spend half their post listing big companies they are trying to get jobs at.

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Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, there is an edit link right there in your post. I would describe op's behavior as "desperate" more than creepy. Desperation is really easy to spot and unappealing, my guess is that is shows through in interviews.

Desperate is what the primary person feels. Creeped out is what the receiving person feels. When does desperate become creepy? Everyone has a different definition. If I was an exec on the receiving end, I'd definitely be put off by all of this.

Personally, I can feel someone's desperation and it feels a lot different to me than when someone is being socially awkward or a creep.

But as someone who's done hiring before they are all pretty big put offs (maybe socially awkward isn't bad as long as it not a interaction heavy role).

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#325

Your writing is not strong, i can tell you did not attend college. Written communication is important in tech. Your applying to those companies with 0 experience or college degree is unrealistic. The entry level is extremely competitive and you have nothing to make you interesting to hire. They get thousands of applications for those jobs. You are still young, plenty of time to learn, but I recommend taking a step ba…

Not to be argumentative. But yes, I did attend college. Send me a email, and I'll send you an email from my college email address (Hasn't been deactivited yet). I can send you my college transcript if that helps.. Well, I did get hired by IBM as a programmer so... I've contributed to a GNU open source project.. So I feel that I am qualifed for a entry level developer/SecEng/Security Analyst role. I went above my boss…

I can only speak to infosec roles. If that's the route you want to go I think you'll be fine once your experience and skills catch up with your demeanor and confidence. It sounds like you can be a bit of an asshole and create messes for your management, which is morally ambivalent but can interfere with your ability to collect income.

I'd recommend aiming a little lower and a little smaller in the jobs you're applying for. Maybe try entry level spot at a regional bank/hospital/edu and in the interim working on skilling up in more tangible ways (e.g. bug bounties, GitHub projects and it never hurts to pick up a specialty). You have no degree so think of this as a 2-3 year plan to substitute it with experience before going for what you're after.

Good luck dude. You've got some very valuable raw materials, they just need refined a bit and you'll be a beast!

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#326
post #42

Brutally candid advice? You sound like a creep. Am I reading it right here, you spoofed your number to talk to executives? In the best case, they'll assume you're a pen-tester; but more likely, you're blacklisted from those companies now. I wish there was, like, short and simple advice that I could give you to not be a creep. I just tried to google that, and I'm not finding a good clear resource. Like most social ski…

[flagged]

I had this same read. Also I'm incredibly disappointed to see this very kind and encouraging approach marked "flagged dead". OP doesn't seem to be upset about discussing the possibility and added some helpful clarification. This comment shouldn't be moderated the way it has been.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#327
post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not challenging you on whether or not you're smart. I'm commenting on the fact that you're unable to find employment, which means either you're carrying yourself incorrectly or you're unable to perform the tasks required of an entry-level applicant. You're bringing up this resume, these achievements, which can verify that you're intelligent and capable of critical thinking, so the greatest culprit would be that y…

Its important to remember being smart and being good at your job, are very different things. Many jobs do not require much intelligence. Even those that do, usually its just one component of the skills required.

I can vouch for that. Often what employers want is someone they can rely on.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#328
post #83

First off, your HN submission history is really weird, dude. ( https://news.ycombinator.com/submitted?id=snakedoctor ) If you get a job in customer support at Amazon there is literally no way to get a 'promotion' to a dev role. It's different parts of the org, and you're tarnished with being a CS person. Why? Because it's signaling - people who can do eng roles at Amazon don't take CS roles so they don't bother minin…

Thanks, dude. Yeah I was hesitant if I should've accepted the CS offer. I was planning to transfer internally to a SecEng/Analyst/SDE 1 role. It might've been possible. I tried applying internally, but my applications would just turn in to no longer considered after a while. ytcracker works at Amazon. I sent you an email to take you up on your mock interview offer.

At Amazon internal transfers don't work by clicking the "Apply" button. You reach out to the hiring manager first and have a coffee together, then if that goes well they setup the internal loop, if that goes well the hiring manager tells you to apply and you get the job. You don't apply until after you have it.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Homeschooling is frequently paired with some degree of insular.

Only in the (few) news stories you read about some sick family; I'm convinced those are hand-picked outliers to reinforce a narrative that homeschooling=bad.

There is no need for a family to be "sick" or not loving for homeschooling to end up being a little insular.

I grew up being home schooled while traveling the world. It definitely resulted in weaker social skills as I lacked long friendships. Making lasting friendships and maintaining relationships is a skill I had to learn later in life.

Re: Ask HN: How can a unhireable person get a job?

#330
post #113
post #42

Brutally candid advice? You sound like a creep. Am I reading it right here, you spoofed your number to talk to executives? In the best case, they'll assume you're a pen-tester; but more likely, you're blacklisted from those companies now. I wish there was, like, short and simple advice that I could give you to not be a creep. I just tried to google that, and I'm not finding a good clear resource. Like most social ski…

you call him a creep, I would call him a go getter. it is immensely frustrating to deal with automated systems, resume keyword matchers, no contact within a company and being ghosted after taking the time to write a proposal and cover letter that is a fit for the job description. so what, he called an executive and got around their spam filter? my advice treat job hunting like a sales process. you're successful based…

I mean, you have a hmguy that's hustling got three great opportunities and gave them up. So, maybe hustling for a job but not to use it to lranlrn anything to get the skills for the next job.
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