Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress • Hacker News Board

Re: Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress

#271

Post by Havoc » Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:32 PM UTC

steveBK123 wrote: post #117

Of course if you actually work in financial services industry, your personal trading is extremely restricted. This is regardless of being in no position to see positions/flow/etc that would give you any insider edge. The industry generally sees it as easier to show compliance by having locked down personal trading by employees. Usually this takes the form of - ETFs only, pre-clearance required, 30 day holding periods…

> and sometimes all of the above.

And you need to grant them access to the broker data feed and no derivatives.

It's in part why I'm suddenly into crypto.

Re: Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress

#272

Post by dysrend » Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:33 PM UTC

frankfrankfrank wrote: post #236

slowmovintarget wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A significant percentage of random average people have no practical understanding of economics, and no ability to think of consequences to policy. Granted, neither do a significant percentage of the currently serving congress if current policy is anything to go by.

Regardless of whether one may like the initial selection criteria or not, what you describe is precisely why the country (USA) was supposed to be led by land owning free white men. The assumption being that people that fit that criteria, plausibly possessed a requisite initial selection criteria set of skills and knowledge that would constitute the pool of best qualified people to run a government in the common inter…

Democracy≠republic

The career politicians, intelligencia, and c-suite technocrats have been running shit for the past half century or more - you see where it's gotten us, to the ruin you describe.

Re: Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress

#273

Post by jkepler » Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:33 PM UTC

throwawaygh wrote: post #194

psychlops wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just require them to announce their trades publicly 24 hours in advance. And let them manage their own finances. All these shenanigan's would disappear.

Why not just prohibit members of Congress of owning stock? They are some of the most powerful people in the world. Why is it so much to ask that a Senator or especially Representative serving in the most powerful legislative body in the world just take a cash position for 2-6 years?

I think they're too aware that with real dollar inflation probably running at least 10% per year (per Michael Saylor), they'd loose too much value for them to consent to holding only cash for 2 to 6 years. For every $100K they had, they'd end up holding something near $81K down to $53K in real purchasing power... and that's assuming they were content to only stay in power one term.

Re: Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress

#274

Post by TheCoelacanth » Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:34 PM UTC

tomcam wrote: post #262

TheCoelacanth wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Congress is bound by the same rules as the general public, they just aren't legally insiders. Insider trading requires not only material, non-public but also some kind of duty of confidentiality to the company you are trading. Congress doesn't have that type of relationship, so they are not insiders. Their spouses aren't either. There are some additional rules that apply to people who gain knowledge in an official ca…

Well they aren't legally insiders because... they made the rules.

Not really, they aren't insiders because when courts interpreted the rather vague laws against fraud in the context of securities trading, they didn't interpret Congress trading based on knowledge received in their job as fraud.

Re: Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress

#275

Post by _underfl0w_ » Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:34 PM UTC

infinite8s wrote: post #202

paulryanrogers wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't this already an illegal conflict of interest? Are federal representatives immune?

Congress excluded itself from insider-trading laws. Convenient, eh?

Can anyone cite a source for this? I don't doubt the legitimacy, but would like to know more about it.

Re: Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress

#276

Post by xienze » Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:34 PM UTC

throwawaygh wrote: post #194

psychlops wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just require them to announce their trades publicly 24 hours in advance. And let them manage their own finances. All these shenanigan's would disappear.

Why not just prohibit members of Congress of owning stock? They are some of the most powerful people in the world. Why is it so much to ask that a Senator or especially Representative serving in the most powerful legislative body in the world just take a cash position for 2-6 years?

> Why is it so much to ask that a Senator or especially Representative serving in the most powerful legislative body in the world just take a cash position for 2-6 years?

I agree in principle, but a lot of these people literally serve until they drop dead, which is a different problem with congress. Might be a bit much to tell someone not to invest for 40+ years.

Re: Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress

#277

Post by jb775 » Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:36 PM UTC

throwaway5752 wrote: post #152

wpietri wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whatever the behind-the-scenes truth, I think the appearance of conflicting interests is a problem regardless. For a lot of elected offices and high public service positions, I think their wealth should be put into a blind trust, one constrained by law to buy broad, boring things like index funds. That would surely be a problem for some individuals. But I don't think it's a systemic problem. We only need to find 0.00…

I speak for a lot of people that while I agree with you in principle, the sudden interest in this idea in Republican circles after the prior administration's absolute mockery of conflict of interest and self-dealing laws seems hypocritical.

Can you provide any sources for your claims that prove Trump administration personnel directly profited off any supposed self dealings? Or are you just pulling this out of your ass bc you are a lib? Also, who else specifically do you "speak for"?

This article isn't even about self-serving decisions that may benefit politicians down the road...it's about politicians who are actively using politician-privy inside information for short term profit at the expense of their constituents. But hey let's keep crying about orange man bad!

Re: Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress

#278

Post by ianthiel » Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:36 PM UTC

ABeeSea wrote: post #118

sakopov wrote: post #15

> For example, Pelosi in Dec 22 was against more stimulus. Her husband buys deep ITM TSLA and AAPL calls that day. December 23rd, she is suddenly for stimulus again, with those same companies ralling 5%, giving her an instant +30 return. > Congressman Gottheimer is absolutely an incredible options trader. He’s been selling calls at peaks on $MSFT all 2021, & seemingly buying back the contracts on dips. This in blocks…

> Pelosi in Dec 22 was against more stimulus. This is not true. It’s very odd to see the kind of right-wing conspiracies based on outright fabrications spread on HN as literal truths. Here is an article from December 22 were Pelosi is calling for more stimulus: www.cnbc.com/amp/2020/12/22/trump-calls-covid-relief-bill-unsuitable-and-demands-congress-add-higher-stimulus-payments.html Here is her direct tweet dated 12/…

Why is this being downvoted? These are references to primary sources that directly contradict facts presented.

Re: Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress

#279

Post by _underfl0w_ » Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:37 PM UTC

frankfrankfrank wrote: post #236

slowmovintarget wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A significant percentage of random average people have no practical understanding of economics, and no ability to think of consequences to policy. Granted, neither do a significant percentage of the currently serving congress if current policy is anything to go by.

Regardless of whether one may like the initial selection criteria or not, what you describe is precisely why the country (USA) was supposed to be led by land owning free white men. The assumption being that people that fit that criteria, plausibly possessed a requisite initial selection criteria set of skills and knowledge that would constitute the pool of best qualified people to run a government in the common inter…

> but it is objectively the best selection system one could possibly devise

Your determination of objectivity seems a little... subjective.

Maybe this was objectively best at the time but at minimum the race part seems to no longer be true.

Re: Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress

#280

Post by TheCoelacanth » Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:39 PM UTC

jonhohle wrote: post #270

TheCoelacanth wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Congress is bound by the same rules as the general public, they just aren't legally insiders. Insider trading requires not only material, non-public but also some kind of duty of confidentiality to the company you are trading. Congress doesn't have that type of relationship, so they are not insiders. Their spouses aren't either. There are some additional rules that apply to people who gain knowledge in an official ca…

This falls under misappropriation which does not require the reader to any relationship to the company being traded, only material, non-public information.

I'm not aware of any case law finding that Congress using their knowledge is misappropriation. Do you have any examples to the contrary?