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A top-grossing scam on the App Store

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Re: A top-grossing scam on the App Store

#101

Post by tracedddd »

tolmasky wrote: post #54

Apple has just engineered the worst possible situation for themselves by being the only way to get apps on the store and by simultaneously incessantly marketing the store as "Safe and Secure". The former encourages them to maximize the number of apps on the store, while the latter encourages them to shoot first and ask questions later. If side-loading or alternative ways of getting apps onto the iPhone existed, then…

I think it would still poison the “Apple experience” to have many AppStores all competing with their own closed ecosystems. The Apple Experience of not being able to install some apps sucks, but its always been easy for me to help someone with an iOS device. That’s not true with Android or Windows. A walled garden ecosystem isn’t for everyone, but it does have value.

Instead, I’d like to see Apple be forced to provide bootloader unlocks and some basic drivers for alternative operating systems. We own the hardware, after all. Then they could have their walled garden and people who wanted more could run something else.

It’s also a simpler and more generalizable goal, in my opinion. If you own it, you should have low level access. That sounds more reasonable than forcing a corporation to add open App Store access, maintain it, and deal with whatever market effects precipitate.

Re: A top-grossing scam on the App Store

#102

Post by sjg007 »

WesolyKubeczek wrote: post #84
sjg007 wrote: post #55

Google isn't immune either I suspect. Before the app store, I discovered a google search scam for usps change of address. You can fill that out for free at usps.com or in the post office, but if you search for it, a bunch of scammy providers offered to do it for you for $20. They were buying google ads so that their links appeared before the usps. They would come from somewhat legit looking domains too. I think part…

Google's Play Store is a cesspit at times, frankly speaking. But you enter it with low expectations since they don't advertise it to you as a walled garden experience, curation by hand, artisanal repackaging, and whatnot, and you tune your buyer beware sense to 11. On the other hand, Apple's like a restaurant that promises you clean and superior experience, you enter, it's clean and tidy indeed, but then you suddenly…

I think buyer beware isn't really effective for the general public. As techies, sure, but for everyone else? There's a reason this app is making $5m a month.

Re: A top-grossing scam on the App Store

#103

Post by amelius »

tolmasky wrote: post #54

Apple has just engineered the worst possible situation for themselves by being the only way to get apps on the store and by simultaneously incessantly marketing the store as "Safe and Secure". The former encourages them to maximize the number of apps on the store, while the latter encourages them to shoot first and ask questions later. If side-loading or alternative ways of getting apps onto the iPhone existed, then…

The real issue is that "AppStore" and "ContentFilter" are two orthogonal things (which Apple conflates).

We can have multiple instances of both. And we probably should.

Re: A top-grossing scam on the App Store

#104

Post by Hackbraten »

mdoms wrote: post #73
jjtheblunt wrote: post #9

The assertion in that title is patently false click-bait. Apple definitely cares about its customers being driven away from them. That doesn't mean they've caught all scams, or more importantly in this case have managed to automate detection of them all, definitely not as fast as folks online identify them. Also note that there are entire classes of scams that never get click baity titles because Apple DOES detect th…

Did you even read the thread? Apple is aware of this because they already took the step of removing fake reviews from the app. You don't think they took 5 minutes to read the legit reviews, or do you think they did read them and they didn't raise any alarm bells?

Your first question is not helpful at all.

Re: A top-grossing scam on the App Store

#105

Post by simion314 »

valparaiso wrote: post #70
simion314 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Apple has no such market position to abuse. It depends how you want to measure things, in US iOS has more then 50% mobile market share but Apple fanboys will use only this numbers (or how many more purchases are on Apple sore) in the conversations about how cool Apple is, when we talk about the monopoly/duopoly then world wide numbers are used, maybe throw more type of devices in there... I would say that Apple is c…

It seems you skipped preliminary hearing in September 2020. Judge already asked why Epic thinks Apple walled garden (closed platform) is illegal while such types of businesses were legal for decades. Also judge rejected comparison of open and closed platforms. So she asked Epic lawyers what's the difference between Apple's closed platform and Xbox/PlayStation and Nintendo. Epic lawyers failed badly without answering.…

Let's see what happens in EU. And FYI Sony and Nintendo are also wrong in my opinion for locking their devices though people don't complain as much since so far they found ways to bypass the locks.

Re: A top-grossing scam on the App Store

#106

Post by m463 »

simonw wrote: post #60

I got scammed on the App Store a couple of weeks ago. I needed the SmartThings app for some Samsung home automation devices, searched for it, and installed this one: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/smart-things-smart-view-app/id... When it charged me a $20/year subscription (now cancelled) I thought "Wow, Samsung charging me for this feels pretty cheap of them, but I guess that's how they do things - after all, I found…

There is something about restrictions and subscriptions.

Someone I know had a family plan thing with restrictions on their kid, but then got automatically charged for an app subscription somehow. Maybe install free app is ok, but auto-subscription bypasses restrictions?

Re: A top-grossing scam on the App Store

#107

Post by socialist_coder »

WesolyKubeczek wrote: post #92
socialist_coder wrote: post #52

The scam really is about the iOS Subscriptions and how its easy to have a free trial then auto-bill you for some absurd amount. Very easy to trick people into doing this. Apple should just remove Subscriptions completely and have app developers turn them into consumable IAPs that you have to buy every X months. The app developer can still do a free trial in their own code. Games do this all the time with "premium". Y…

> Apple should just remove Subscriptions completely and have app developers turn them into consumable IAPs that you have to buy every X months. With my data going poof each time, I'm afraid that's a no. Even merely having to log in again, compared to the status quo, is way worse.

I think you are saying that if you uninstall/reinstall, you could lose your subscription since it's from a consumable IAP. I agree that is a bad flow and something that Apple could fix by still allowing non-renewing subscriptions, and then changing how the free trial works by not triggering a payment automatically after the free trial. Basically, you should only be charged as a result of a user action, and it would go through the same IAP flow that people do not just blindly tap through.

Re: A top-grossing scam on the App Store

#108

Post by simonh »

tolmasky wrote: post #54

Apple has just engineered the worst possible situation for themselves by being the only way to get apps on the store and by simultaneously incessantly marketing the store as "Safe and Secure". The former encourages them to maximize the number of apps on the store, while the latter encourages them to shoot first and ask questions later. If side-loading or alternative ways of getting apps onto the iPhone existed, then…

How would the security model work with side loaded apps. How would they get access to OS resources, services and share data with other apps, e.g through the clipboard? Who would verify them against malware, or ensure they didn’t violate security constraints? It’s not like Apple could disavow all responsibility for any data leaked from the system, a lot of users simply wouldn’t see it that way.

There’s a lot wrong with the current state of apps in the App Store, but right now at least I know who’s job it is to get it fixed.

Re: A top-grossing scam on the App Store

#109

Post by jackson1442 »

hans-moleman wrote: post #80
55555 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can see you are being downvoted but this is literally how this works. People install things and click rapidly thru the startup screens. These apps generally get legal consent from everyone who is billed, they just either didn't read it or forgot to cancel.

A big issue I see is from the switch to Face ID from Touch ID. With Touch ID you actually had to put your finger on the sensor to confirm payment. Now with Face ID that dialog just becomes another OK you accidentally press and your face gets scanned before you even realize what’s happening.

You still have to double click the side button… it’s pretty clear to me when I’m paying for stuff on my phone, at least.

Re: A top-grossing scam on the App Store

#110

Post by Daho0n »

tracedddd wrote: post #101
tolmasky wrote: post #54

Apple has just engineered the worst possible situation for themselves by being the only way to get apps on the store and by simultaneously incessantly marketing the store as "Safe and Secure". The former encourages them to maximize the number of apps on the store, while the latter encourages them to shoot first and ask questions later. If side-loading or alternative ways of getting apps onto the iPhone existed, then…

I think it would still poison the “Apple experience” to have many AppStores all competing with their own closed ecosystems. The Apple Experience of not being able to install some apps sucks, but its always been easy for me to help someone with an iOS device. That’s not true with Android or Windows. A walled garden ecosystem isn’t for everyone, but it does have value. Instead, I’d like to see Apple be forced to provid…

How does it matter which policy the app store have in ease of providing support? Providing support in Windows (can't talk for Android) isn't hard at all.
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