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CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

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Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#441

Post by ccortes »

Kalium wrote: post #361
ccortes wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Not a real problem. Any civilized country has solved identity already. Jesus Christ. So the only problems that matter are the ones in "civilized" countries? What does that even mean?

Perhaps it means that this is a known problem with known working solutions. Countries that haven't solved identity are ones that either don't want to or can't, generally due to a mix of corruption and poverty. Perhaps I am simply suffering a tragic failure of imagination, but I fail to see how adding a blockchain changes things substantially.

> Countries that haven't solved identity are ones that either don't want to or can't, generally due to a mix of corruption and poverty

It's not a known problem because each country has its own context. That's like saying US healthcare problem can be solved just by doing what nordic countries do.

I'm not arguing for blockchain.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#443

Post by puranjay »

cam0 wrote: post #354
puranjay wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point, I don't even care about Bitcoin anymore. It serves no purpose. I don't even care about cryptocurrencies as such. But the ideas popping out from these fields are just so darn exciting. DeFi makes all these complex financial instruments that were previously the sole purview of big banks accessible to anyone . And we're barely scratching the surface with NFTs and DAOs.

I think it's exciting too, but I'm also a little weary of making these complex financial instruments more prevalent. I see more of a downside to the increase in these instruments overall. Still fascinating to watch unfold though.

I see the downside as well, but all the same, I'd be happy if I can own the rewards and the risk. If I go broke because of experimenting with this stuff, I'll be okay with it - it's my money, my mistakes.

Lots of people went broke in 2008 because of their bankers' mistakes.

It strikes at the heart of ownership and responsibility and I can't understand why HN isn't bullish about it. Everyone here loves the idea of owning their data and their hardware and their software but somehow, their money should be owned by...bankers? So they can invest it in junk and crash the market?

Doesn't make sense to me.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#444

Post by tim333 »

rudderz wrote: post #137
kelnos wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Whatever your stance on cryptocurrencies are, what is of little dispute is the business opportunities they have created. Binance and Coinbase are large, successful companies. Poloniex was sold for ~400M. I find this argument a little weird, because I think we can all agree that bubbles and fad tech isn't really great for society as a whole. If you believe cryptocurrencies aren't a fad and actually provide useful be…

Take crypto out of the equation, what are the implications of the fed issuing a programmable currency? Many financial services would become obsolete. What do I need a stock broker for? What do I need a bank for? You have Wall St and other sophisticated investors profiteering and competing against the general public, devaluing our purchasing power, making leveraged trades because they know the public will hold the bag…

>What do I need a stock broker for?

You still have that stuff with crypto, just crypto exchanges not stock exchanges.

>What do I need a bank for?

Banks do two main things - taking savings and lend that out as mortgages. Crypto has been no good at part two.

Basically most financial services would still exist if in modified form.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#445

Post by noxer »

bellyfullofbac wrote: post #336
noxer wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its clearly not better, its worse. You exchange possible interest rates with a rather incalculable risk of total loss or some absurd insurance fees which are likely to be higher. If putting paper in a safe would be better then someone (probably the bank itself) would offer that as a service. If they cant make it lucrative at scale you certainly cant either.

Sigh, you made me regret responding to your initial question. FWIW commercial banks have had negative interest rates for a few years now. https://www.truewealth.ch/en/blog/negative-interest-switzerl...

You completely ignore my point and instead provided a proof for what no one questioned.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#446

Post by puranjay »

Barrin92 wrote: post #218
puranjay wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DeFi has a legitimate use case and NFTs have an astonishing number of use cases. Smart Contracts are an incredible, incredible innovation. We are at the tip of the iceberg and nothing has been more disappointing than seeing the traditional tech world's dismissal of crypto as "get rich schemes". The tech world is surprisingly as complacent now as the legacy dinosaurs it first helped destroy in the 1990s and 2000s.

>NFTs have an astonishing number of use cases NFTs are the equivalent of trading cards or video game lootboxes. They enable a form of conspicuous consumption whereby you conjure up value by slapping a digital signature on something and creating artificial scarcity. From the perspective of the state none of these instruments improve supply chains, enhance military or state capacity, increase productivity or growth. NF…

NFTs can store any data. Currently, they're used for art but more and more crypto projects are deploying them for store different types of data on chain. You can tokenize anything and track it on chain - music, art, physical goods, real-world bonds.

In the simplest form, they can be used to fractionalize ownership. Integrate these ownership records with existing infrastructure and you can suddenly transform ownership and royalties.

I'll give you an example.

I'm an amateur musician and every pro musician I know has harrowing tales of being shafted by record labels. They have no power to negotiate because they need the money. Most get paid cents on the dollar and record labels keep the bulk of royalties.

Imagine a situation where a musician can mint an album as an NFT and put it up for sale. 100 people can buy 1% each of it. This entitles them to 1% of the royalties earned from the album. Since all this data is on-chain, it's easy to verify.

Now suppose there's a music platform integrates NFTs. Every time a user plays a song, the platform verifies ownership records from the blockchain and distributes royalties to addresses that own the NFT.

Suddenly, you've completely decentralized and democratized ownership. You've bypassed gatekeepers. And you've given the chance to anyone, no matter where they are, to invest in - and get invested by - anyone.

How is this not revolutionary?

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#447

Post by puranjay »

Barrin92 wrote: post #245
arisAlexis wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Art is only one use case. NFTs can represent land ownership, driving licenses etc.

sure but putting a license on the internet isn't that innovative. Our driers licenses are pretty good and pretty cheap, and we've proven land-ownership over generations pretty well. This is not world-changing stuff. If you want radical innovation build some robots that make house construction 90% cheaper, whether the license for my house is printed on paper or a blockchain doesn't matter to anyone. NFTs and virtually…

Putting a license on the internet isn't innovative. Putting a license that can be owned in fractions is.

Most deals in the real world are already fractionalized. If someone is building a new housing complex, he is likely going to raise funds from a bunch of investors, each of which will get a share of ownership based on their investment and negotiation skills. The only way to invest in these deals is if you know people and are in the right place at the right time. There are gatekeepers aplenty and you need big capital to get in.

If you were to tokenize the same new housing complex, anyone, anywhere can buy it up. Ownership records are transparent. There are no gatekeepers. And ownership is fully democratized. You might have $1 to your name but you can still claim to have ownership of this spanking new housing complex (even if its 0.0001%) - no intermediaries involved.

It opens up previously unavailable opportunities to anyone, not just the people with the connections and the big wallets.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#448

Post by puranjay »

jonfw wrote: post #171
puranjay wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DeFi's main value proposition is the automation of money. NFTs main value proposition is fractional ownership and assertion of ownership rights in a transparent manner. Imagine owning 1% of a Drake song - and getting paid 1% of the royalties every time it plays on Spotify. Or creating a yield earning strategy that automatically moves money around based on fixed paramters without ever interacting with a banker or fund…

The reason we don't have fractional ownership of pop songs is because that's a bad idea, not because we can't figure out how to organize it.

Why would that be a bad idea? I don't know a single musician who says that record labels stealing 90% of their work is a good thing.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#449

Post by tim333 »

graeme wrote: post #226
cslarson wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can you not see what the importance of this new infrastructure? I come here and read these comments and am just at a loss for words at this point. Forget Bitcoin and look at Ethereum. This tech is so powerful I am in some ways scared of it and you call it a fad. The gulf between our interpretations drops my jaw to the floor :)

Can you name some use cases that aren’t trading crypto derivatives or crypto debt? Ethereum is certainly more interesting than Bitcoin but the use cases so far seem to be more speculation.

NFTs!

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#450

Post by puranjay »

arcticbull wrote: post #154
puranjay wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will only prove Bitoin holders right.

lol, it will prove them broke. The overwhelming majority of people own bitcoin because number go up. Banning it will make number not go up. This will cause them to divest. Substantially nobody is in it for the ancap utopia espoused by $20 transaction fees and 30 minute long confirmation times.

If that happens and people don't get mad, it will be truly, truly sad.

Most people here are pro ownership. If you think everyone should own their data (they should), why wouldn't you think that everyone should also own their money?

Crypto might be a 'scam', but at least I get to own the risks. Giving up ownership means that my money is just used by bankers to invest in their own scams, and when they screw up, bail them out again.

You can't be pro data ownership and anti money ownership.

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