How People Get Rich Now • Hacker News Board

Re: How People Get Rich Now

#801

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 1:59 AM UTC

mike00632 wrote: post #753

mmmmmbop wrote: post #611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuinely curious: Do you have any more background on this? Who are these rich people that are not listed in Forbes?

This is an ongoing curiosity of mine. One really cool example is Mubarak of Egypt who became wealthy from corruption. When he lost power he had some wealth exposed and he was richer than any known person in the world. https://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2011/04/11/egyptia... It's very likely that the richest person in the world right now is Vladimir Putin.

[deleted]

Re: How People Get Rich Now

#802

Post by dillondoyle » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 2:00 AM UTC

mmmmmbop wrote: post #611

qzw wrote: post #464

I'm rather disappointed PG would think that the Forbes wealth list could support any kind of conclusion whatsoever. One of the biggest reasons that the top of the list is filled with tech billionaires is that their wealth is relatively transparent, being mostly in the form of stock holdings in publicly traded companies and often directly disclosed. This makes it much easier for Forbes to estimate their net worth with…

Genuinely curious: Do you have any more background on this? Who are these rich people that are not listed in Forbes?

Really good Bloomberg piece just came out. "Bill Hwang Had $20 Billion, Then Lost It All in Two Days"

That would be top 100 - and it was totally liquid. Not locked up in owner shares

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2021-04-08/how-bill-...

Re: How People Get Rich Now

#803

Post by AnimalMuppet » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 2:01 AM UTC

Florin_Andrei wrote: post #789

missedthecue wrote: post #747

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My argument eliminated the third option. It doesn't hold water.

So, you're still missing the point. Or "missing" the point, not sure which. Interesting.

No, you're ignoring where he answered the point. You're not answering his argument, you're trying to pretend that he never made it.

I'll admit I had to look fairly hard to find where he did, but he did in fact answer that. (Not saying that I necessarily agree with his answer, but he gave it. Refute it rather than saying he's dodging answering.)

Re: How People Get Rich Now

#804

Post by handmodel » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 2:02 AM UTC

hnick wrote: post #784

benzor wrote: post #324

There's some nuggets of truth in here, but I am disappointed that this article sidesteps what I feel is the most important reason for startup success in 2020: easy and abundant access to cheap capital. - Interest rates are at all time lows, borrowing is cheap - The Fed's balance sheet is at an all-time high. The economy is flush with cash, particularly the investor / VC class - This excess cash creates an (arguably a…

> These companies achieve growth and put pressure on the competition by offering their services below the real cost that would be needed to achieve profit, hence driving huge share price growth Which I find weird, if I sell fruit at a loss to run a local competitor out of business as a major supermarket it's illegal predatory pricing (or at least was when I was growing up), yet do it to an entire industry and it's fi…

I don't think this covers all of this - but I feel like the reason it could never be investigated is that most of these things are only unprofitable because of the administration. Not on a per item basis.

Netflix may lose money on their show but clearly by giving you a month free and then charging just $12 a month they are making money on that unit. AirBNB is making money on each additional rental they do even if historically that didnt cover all marketing and tech.

For a store selling berries if they buy it for $3 and sell it for $2 then it is more tangible (though Im sure today they could just call it marketing)

Re: How People Get Rich Now

#805

Post by handmodel » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 2:06 AM UTC

int_19h wrote: post #795

oconnor663 wrote: post #779

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At some point I guess you run into definitional questions around what counts as wealth or ownership. If you could seize any building in your country at will, do you own all of them? What if you could probably only size a few dozen before people started getting angry about it? Etc.

The same goes for stock, though. When we talk about billionaires, most of that money is invested somewhere. So nominally it's worth $X because it's N shares worth $Y each; but if they try to sell them all off rapidly, that would drive the price down. Finding enough buyers might also get tricky.

I sometimes think this is overrated. Bezos has as much stock as anyone but if he sold it all in the course of a year I don't think it would lose value. Musk probably would - but only so many people on the top of the list (at least I think)are in a position where there company worth would drop dramatically from the founder selling.

Re: How People Get Rich Now

#806

Post by giantg2 » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 2:17 AM UTC

bradlys wrote: post #762

giantg2 wrote: post #714

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are some companies on the east coast that want mostly PhDs. I have a Masters, but that's really nothing. I feel like degrees don't really mean much. They just show you put in your time (and money) and have at least half a brain. I've also seen highly educated people who aren't very good at independent thought. "People in other areas have jobs. People in SV have careers." This seems a little over generalized and…

It's a general sentiment. People here keep nitpicking about the generality of statements I'm making. They're not getting the general vibe and the general vibe is the point. Just because you can cherrypick some data that says there are people with careers or people with PhDs in some other area does not mean that it is like SV. Surely you understand that? Who the fuck would move here when homes are $2-3m? People who ar…

"People who are dedicated."

I think it's more about people who want some sort of status or virtue signaling. There are plenty of successful start ups in other cities like Seattle, NYC, NOVA, Austin, etc.

I think the reason people are "nitpicking" is because the majority of people don't live in SV. So if anything, talking about dev salary and saying $400k is barely enough, one would have to cherry pick data from SV to justify that statement.

Re: How People Get Rich Now

#807

Post by d110af5ccf » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 2:23 AM UTC

adwn wrote: post #388

purple_ferret wrote: post #95

>So it's not 2020 that's the anomaly here, but 1982. The real question is why so few people had gotten rich from starting companies in 1982...a wave of consolidation was sweeping through the American economy Microsoft, Oracle, Apple, Bloomberg, etc were all started in the late 70's/ early 80's. Their founders are the richest people in the world. Seems like the question he's asking, though, is why weren't they obscene…

> Every time I read one of PG's posts, it seems like he's working from a narrative that he's trying to conform facts to. Indeed. Compare this gem from [1]: You could probably work twice as many hours as a corporate employee, and if you focus you can probably get three times as much done in an hour. [1] You should get another multiple of two, at least, by eliminating the drag of the pointy-haired middle manager who wo…

I'm not seeing the issue with the except you posted. In context, it seems clear to me that those are all very back of the envelope estimations. Not everything needs to be backed by multiple citations to double blind trials; approximations can be quite useful.

The point (IMO) is to take statements you strongly suspect to be true from personal experience (ex that a pointy-haired middle manager reduces your productivity) and attempt to assign ballpark numbers to them. The numbers don't need to be super accurate, merely within the correct order of magnitude. The hope is that such an exercise might allow you to estimate an expected return (to within an order of magnitude) for decision making purposes, or perhaps just to better understand the world around you.

Put another way, even if you dispute the exact outcome ($3 million a year), presumably you agree with the broader premise of being significantly more productive? (Note that increased productivity won't necessarily translate to increased income. It should give you something to work with though.)

Re: How People Get Rich Now

#808

Post by refenestrator » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 2:46 AM UTC

WalterBright wrote: post #793

refenestrator wrote: post #776

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're all stockholders, and anyone with a 401k is, by way of Vanguard and Blackrock.

So don't invest in corporations who you believe overpay their CEO.

1) The CEO compensation, while grotesque, is a drop in the bucket. Would I avoid eBay because they've employed a revolving door of terrible CEOs? No, I avoid them because they're a bum opportunity. The CEOs know this, better ones go elsewhere, yet somehow they still pay top dollar for the leftovers they can get.

Good company, bad company, the CEO compensation won't drive the stock price. It's still grotesque and unnecessary, you could pay half or less and get the same mediocre result in most cases.

2) I lied, I don't avoid eBay. I buy the same index funds as everyone else. Shareholder activism is a myth right now unless you're one of a very few people controlling in actuality a very small % of the market.

Re: How People Get Rich Now

#809

Post by jhugo » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 2:51 AM UTC

greggman3 wrote: post #788

fairity wrote: post #781

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment leaves me wondering if we're reading the same essay. PG specifically states that the "main reason it's easier to start a startup now is that it's cheaper". And, "cheaper" comes in the form of lower infrastructure costs, lower advertising costs, and lower cost of capital. >> But the main reason it's easier to start a startup now is that it's cheaper. Technology has driven down the cost of both building pr…

I'm not sure what your point is . The article says it "cheaper to do". The person you're responding to says "there's access to cheap capital".

> now investors need founders more than founders need investors, and that, combined with the increasing amount of venture capital available, has driven up valuations.

Re: How People Get Rich Now

#810

Post by prawn » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 3:02 AM UTC

CameronNemo wrote: post #658

mmmmmbop wrote: post #611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuinely curious: Do you have any more background on this? Who are these rich people that are not listed in Forbes?

I've never looked at that list so I have no idea who is on it. Is there a reason I care who the richest people on earth are?

This is a bit "I don't even own a TV" in a thread about TV shows. The topic is wealth and the industries/methods behind it. You're responding to two people having an interesting discussion about known and unknown riches.