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CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

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Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#391

Post by [deleted] »

tootahe45 wrote: post #345
c01n wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

- Pseudonymous Transactions / Privacy - Multiple Accounts - International Transfers - Customization (smart contracts) - Micro Payments / Internet money - Low entry (Phone, internet) - Peer 2 Peer and decentralized - Free Software

> - Micro Payments / Internet money Isn't eth terrible at this? i have $12 USDT stuck on an eth address because i need to spent $30 worth of eth to send it. That's not even including the fee I'll incur when i have to send eth to the address to fund it..

[deleted]

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#392

Post by Daishiman »

gsempe wrote: post #351
Daishiman wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sovereign identity Not a real problem. Any civilized country has solved identity already. > DAOs A solution in search of a problem > NFTs Speculative. Game items, land registries and deeds are a solved problem. If your jurisdiction/company hasn't solved them already with Postgres and hardcopy it's because it's not interested in solving it or it's not a real problem, just a minor annoyance.

Most of the problems solved are not at their first iteration of solution. There will be a next one for most of them as well. None can deny that the crypto field opens opportunities for the next iteration of solutions

I do deny that they open up any opportunities.

Even if they might do things better (which I don't see that happening; solutions are objectively slower and more cumbersome than centralized databases with audit logging), they appear to solve "problems" that aren't really problems.

There's a lot of things that classify as annoyances and inconveniences in the world. That doesn't mean that I'm willing to dump a boatload of cash to solve them.

Identity isn't currently a technological issue. Microtransactions aren't a technological issue solved by blockchains. Ledgers of most things in general don't have a trust issue that's solved by blockchains.

Technies being techies think that technology solves a lot of issues just by existing while completely discounting the issues of trust and control in institutions themselves.

Most blockchain problems are actually governance issues.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#393

Post by XorNot »

intotheabyss wrote: post #369
viraptor wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want bookkeeping where entries can be rewritten by designated parties, then why would you want ETH / distributed consensus? What does it give you in that case over the existing database with a public mirror? Also laws change. What you signed in an ETH contract today may be completely different than what's legal / possible to enforce tomorrow.

Because you trade and automate assets through contract logic. The benefits of contract composability on Ethereum mean that the velocity of money increases because now assets can be manipulated by logic without an intermediary. So if someone wants to borrow your asset, you can deposit it into a contract and now can lend it out peer to peer, and have interest acrue on an ongoing basis. Assets can be more easily "put to…

You keep saying "asset" as though this means anything. Say my asset is a bulldozer.

How is an automated ethereum contract going to lend it out and ensure its return in good working order, or pursue damages if it is not?

Say my asset is actually just a lump sum of regular US dollars, which I would very much desire to be returned to me as US dollars plus interest so I can my US taxes with them at a later date. How is an ethereum contract going to actually ensure I get my US dollars back, or have resource to pursue them, seeing as how no mechanisms of US dollars are dependent on ethereum?

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#394

Post by Daishiman »

intotheabyss wrote: post #348
Daishiman wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Decentralized networks have the potential to resolve many of the issues we techies love to complain about. I continue to hear this yet I never get a _single_ convincing example from DeFi advocates.

Just take Uniswap for example. Now imagine that every asset on the planet could be represented by a fungible or non-fungible token. You can put a Uniswap plugin into any browser and you now have a universal way to swap between any assets you want, 24/7. You could buy real estate, bonds, gold, stocks, currencies, all from your browser. Now obviously this is not quite a a reality today. Most things exchanged on Uniswap…

> You could buy real estate, bonds, gold, stocks, currencies, all from your browser.

I'm not sure what world you live in where the biggest problem with buying a six-figure investment instruments is that _I can't do it from my browser_.

There's about a thousand things more important in my mind when it comes to investing. For a day trader this might be a problem. For decades-long instruments it isn't.

All the things you mention have issues that go beyond a browser. You could log on to a real estate page and buy a house and that's technically possible, and digital token doesn't do a damn to improve the experience.

I am a thousand times more likely to run into legal permits issues, KYC and anti-money laundering forms, getting stuck reading contractual obligations that certain assets require, etc.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#395

Post by programmarchy »

selectodude wrote: post #384
this_user wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can create all sorts of regulations but that will only harden the stance of crypto maxis because it will only prove them right. They can harden their stance all they want, but breaking the crypto ecosystem is incredibly easy if governments really wanted to. All you have to do is ban companies from interacting with crypto currencies in any form, be it accepting, exchanging, holding, or producing them. That would…

All they'd really have to do is announce that they were going to build enough computing power to initiate a 51 percent attack on bitcoin. I imagine the NSA is already there but it would be a nice cash injection for Intel or whatever. Bitcoin has a very, very short history of being a decent store of value and the US Government publicly saying they plan to break it would collapse the entire scheme.

It’d have to be a very prolonged 51% attack. Other nation states would likely join in, and it’s not like the USG can stop millions of people around the world from mining. Even if they succeeded in driving the price of most coins to zero, it’d be a Pyrrhic victory with USG looking like giant, insecure assholes spending a huge amount of resources just to destroy something that democratized money and banking. Months later, a new white paper would come out that finds a way to disadvantage state actors and viola, the game of whack-a-mole begins anew. People want out of dollars because the US economy is mismanaged, and that demand isn’t going away.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#396

Post by MichaelMoser123 »

stretchwithme wrote: post #234
wayoutthere wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the fed did a cryptocurrency, it would be backed by the full might of the US Government — and all the things that the government can do if it decides to print more money. This also includes military and police powers. Which brings me to the other point: currencies are governed at both ends; at issuance and at use. If you use a crypto that’s not approved, the government can simply arrest you for using one of its co…

I agree. That's why China is doing it.

wow, the DCEP is the big brother version of crypto currencies; https://www.inaa.org/how-does-chinas-dcep-currency-work/

"Instead of relying on forecasts and estimates, the data collected by DCEP payments will provide China’s central bank with a treasure chest of information that can be used to monitor economic trends, predict consumer behaviours and resolve issues before they would normally reveal themselves."

Do you know more about the DCEP? who is setting the rate? How do they support offline transactions? Do they have contracts?

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#397

Post by CuriousSkeptic »

cblconfederate wrote: post #330
this_user wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can create all sorts of regulations but that will only harden the stance of crypto maxis because it will only prove them right. They can harden their stance all they want, but breaking the crypto ecosystem is incredibly easy if governments really wanted to. All you have to do is ban companies from interacting with crypto currencies in any form, be it accepting, exchanging, holding, or producing them. That would…

I mean, companies are barely interacting with crypto right now, very few businesses use it for trade, but it keeps going up so i dont see how that works. US based onramps are useful only to americans, and i m sure people will seek ways to convert their dollars elsewhere, like they did for years before coinbase or other us based exchanges existed

> companies are barely interacting with crypto right now

Not sure that is true

> According to security firm Sophos, 51% of organizations it sampled globally found themselves the targets of ransomware attacks in 2019. The crooks succeeded in encrypting data in 73% of these attacks. Just over a quarter of these organizations paid the ransom, or their insurance companies forked over the cash.

https://m-cacm.acm.org/magazines/2021/4/251337-the-worsening...

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#398

Post by prestigious »

kelnos wrote: post #109
liquidise wrote: post #4

> U.S. Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen and other officials have warned about the use of cryptocurrencies for illicit transactions. Wait until you hear about cash. More seriously (and hopefully less reductionist) i feel nations who embrace cryptocurrencies early will see mixed results as the landscape matures. I am more confident that nations which turn their back on it, or shut it out completely, will see a loss of o…

> Whatever your stance on cryptocurrencies are, what is of little dispute is the business opportunities they have created. Binance and Coinbase are large, successful companies. Poloniex was sold for ~400M. I find this argument a little weird, because I think we can all agree that bubbles and fad tech isn't really great for society as a whole. If you believe cryptocurrencies aren't a fad and actually provide useful be…

How is crypto not useful? Is money useful?

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#399

Post by neatze »

Jasper_ wrote: post #365
tiborsaas wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just as an example, have you heard of smart contracts? There's a cambrian explosion happening now among networks, everybody tweaks something to be different from others. I suggest you to take a look around, there's a shocking diversity. > How does cryptocurrency help with any of that? How can a globally spanning Turing complete computer help? I don't know, but we will see attempts. > Citation needed. Haha, I always f…

> Just as an example, have you heard of smart contracts? Yes. They seem to be a solution looking for a problem. What problems can you imagine smart contracts solving? > How can a globally spanning Turing complete computer help? I don't know, but we will see attempts. So the answer is "nobody has thought of a single way this helps, after 10 years of thinking about it". > But for fun's sake, go to https://coinmarketcap…

Outstanding example of murdered by words.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#400

Post by intotheabyss »

XorNot wrote: post #393
intotheabyss wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because you trade and automate assets through contract logic. The benefits of contract composability on Ethereum mean that the velocity of money increases because now assets can be manipulated by logic without an intermediary. So if someone wants to borrow your asset, you can deposit it into a contract and now can lend it out peer to peer, and have interest acrue on an ongoing basis. Assets can be more easily "put to…

You keep saying "asset" as though this means anything. Say my asset is a bulldozer. How is an automated ethereum contract going to lend it out and ensure its return in good working order, or pursue damages if it is not? Say my asset is actually just a lump sum of regular US dollars, which I would very much desire to be returned to me as US dollars plus interest so I can my US taxes with them at a later date. How is a…

The asset won't be the bulldozer, but ownership of the bulldozer. How did the natives of the Yap islands know who owned which Rai stones? Through social contracts. The same would be the case for bulldozer ownerships on Ethereum. It's just a way for you to prove to other humans (or programs) that you own the bulldozer. If you sell the bulldozer in real life, then presumably the buyer would want the ownership. The difference here is where the ownership data lives, not necessarily who issues it.

There are stablecoins backed by USD reserves, like USDC. Again, the ethereum contract is only a ledger. The people responsible for giving you USD is going to be Gemini who control the supply of USDC. You having proof that you own USDC allows you to withdraw USD.

There are of course stablecoins that are not backed by USD, but rather backed by ETH directly and the USD peg is maintained through arbitrage, oracles and control systems implemented in the contracts.

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