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CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

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Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#71

Post by spurdoman77 »

notyourday wrote: post #43
liquidise wrote: post #4

> U.S. Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen and other officials have warned about the use of cryptocurrencies for illicit transactions. Wait until you hear about cash. More seriously (and hopefully less reductionist) i feel nations who embrace cryptocurrencies early will see mixed results as the landscape matures. I am more confident that nations which turn their back on it, or shut it out completely, will see a loss of o…

> Wait until you hear about cash. Cash is extremely difficult to use in criminal enterprises, especially with the USD. Large amounts of cash are bulky due to $100 being the largest note. Massive amounts of cash is difficult to convert to/from other forms of assets due to CTR, SARs and fed surveillance. Cash as a vehicle for facilitating criminal activity by now is largely fiction. Even diamonds are easier than cash.

Cash is perfect for small criminals. Practically useless for bigger criminals.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#72

Post by insert_coin »

mrtksn wrote: post #55
liquidise wrote: post #4

> U.S. Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen and other officials have warned about the use of cryptocurrencies for illicit transactions. Wait until you hear about cash. More seriously (and hopefully less reductionist) i feel nations who embrace cryptocurrencies early will see mixed results as the landscape matures. I am more confident that nations which turn their back on it, or shut it out completely, will see a loss of o…

The cash argument is not a good take at all. When you travel with large amounts of cash people ask questions, you are obligated to declare it when crossing borders if it’s over certain amount(over 0,25BTC as USD will make you fill out declarations and it may be confiscated until you can prove that it is legitimately yours) depositing it to your bank account rings all kind of bells, the banks can refuse to work with y…

> cash is no good anymore.

Crime is gone now? What else are they going to use?

Crypto is used by less than 1% of the world. All crime uses "cash" relatively speaking.

*a lot of it is "digital" cash but still.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#73

Post by rawtxapp »

puranjay wrote: post #67
justapassenger wrote: post #62

Crackdown on current state of crypto can only help it in the long run, if you actually really believe it. Right now it’s market mostly dedicated to get rich quick schemes. While it works great if you’re on top of the pyramid, it’s only hurting crypto case for the future.

DeFi has a legitimate use case and NFTs have an astonishing number of use cases. Smart Contracts are an incredible, incredible innovation. We are at the tip of the iceberg and nothing has been more disappointing than seeing the traditional tech world's dismissal of crypto as "get rich schemes". The tech world is surprisingly as complacent now as the legacy dinosaurs it first helped destroy in the 1990s and 2000s.

I think it's somewhat similar to innovator's dilemma, a lot of current tech leaders were once the underdog and now are at the top, so they end up becoming complacent and non-innovators or slow innovators like the companies they replaced.

An example of really cool smart contract usage is borrowing against your crypto, for example, this person/group was able to borrow roughly 340M$ [1], the best part, they didn't even had to provide their name or deal with any other human, all enabled by a smart contract that they can inspect and verify.

1: https://defiexplore.com/cdp/8463

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#74

Post by noxer »

tonfa wrote: post #52
retrac wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Canada, organized crime holds on to the $1000 notes. They're the largest value banknote commonly used in the West in the last few decades. They were last issued in 1992 and then officially withdrawn in 2000 for concerns over moneylaundering. They're not legal tender anymore, but can be exchanged at the bank. There's about $1 billion in circulation, and that will likely remain true for a long time yet. They move in…

CHF still has 1k banknote (and with negative interest rates this with a safe might be a better option than a bank account).

Hows that better than a bank account? You can hold CHF on a bank account as well and it keeps the same value as the note. (both lose value due to inflation)

Also dont forget insurance for banknotes in a safe.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#75

Post by puranjay »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #6
NaturalPhallacy wrote: post #3

How? How do you 'crack down' on a currency that doesn't require any existing state or bank controlled apparatus to operate? Other than the exchange point, which private exchanges for cash can circumvent, how do you crack down on what is essentially math conducted via computers that everyone has access to? Neither the article, nor the linked one from December say.

You (government currency regulators) make it illegal to convert fiat to crypto, and then monitor crypto ledgers for that last bit of folks who still attempt to use crypto. When exchanges break the law, you ship the folks who own the exchange to jail [1]. Crypto folks think they're the former cartoon panel, when it's really the latter how nation state enforcement works [2]. Governments crack down on money laundering w…

All this will do is compel companies to move to crypto friendly countries. China squeezed down on crypto. Chinese exchanges just moved their headquarters to Malta.

When you start getting into DAOs and their legal status and everything starts becoming murky.

Crypto has truly some of the most exciting developments taking place in the world today at the intersection of art, finance, law and economics. The quality of discussion on HN about crypto is woefully out of touch.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#76

Post by yladiz »

NaturalPhallacy wrote: post #59
kec wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At some point you need to convert your crypto gains back to fiat to actually use it, especially in the hypothetical case where crypto trade is banned locally. The IRS/FBI/etc are not going to arbitrarily constrain themselves when trying to go after folks who do this.

>At some point you need to convert your crypto gains back to fiat to actually use it Except you don't. It's a currency. Just because it's hot right now and people are treating it like an investment doesn't change the fact that it's a currency itself. You don't need to convert it to anything. It was literally built to be a currency free from bank/government control. That was the whole point. The sole criterion for the…

Okay, sure, let's consider it a currency for the sake of argument. I would posit that if I can't easily exchange my crypto into a form that I can use to pay taxes with, or buy groceries with, that it's a useless currency, and so people will be able to but won't want to accept it in a trade. Currencies aren't useful simply because they _can_ be traded, they're useful because they _can_ be trusted.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#77

Post by dgrin91 »

petertodd wrote: post #23
liquidise wrote: post #4

> U.S. Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen and other officials have warned about the use of cryptocurrencies for illicit transactions. Wait until you hear about cash. More seriously (and hopefully less reductionist) i feel nations who embrace cryptocurrencies early will see mixed results as the landscape matures. I am more confident that nations which turn their back on it, or shut it out completely, will see a loss of o…

> Wait until you hear about cash. I'm always bothered by this arguement because most of the same people in government who want to see a crackdown on Bitcoin also seem to want cash to be eliminated. I've been asked to do consulting on one of these digital cash replacement projects. The requirements included all the stuff you'd expect, like strict ID requirements for every account, and the ability to freeze funds at wi…

> most of the same people in government who want to see a crackdown on Bitcoin also seem to want cash to be eliminated

Can you provide a source for that? First I've heard of such an argument from government officials

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#78

Post by xxxxxxx12 »

spurdoman77 wrote: post #70
petertodd wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wait until you hear about cash. I'm always bothered by this arguement because most of the same people in government who want to see a crackdown on Bitcoin also seem to want cash to be eliminated. I've been asked to do consulting on one of these digital cash replacement projects. The requirements included all the stuff you'd expect, like strict ID requirements for every account, and the ability to freeze funds at wi…

Central bankers are often pro-cash but anti-bitcoin. They dont want competition.

> They dont want competition

Which is another way of saying they want absolute control, which in this case is the absurd charade where "inflation" measures that they claim represent life on the ground exclude the essentials like education, healthcare, and housing.

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#79

Post by kec »

NaturalPhallacy wrote: post #59
kec wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At some point you need to convert your crypto gains back to fiat to actually use it, especially in the hypothetical case where crypto trade is banned locally. The IRS/FBI/etc are not going to arbitrarily constrain themselves when trying to go after folks who do this.

>At some point you need to convert your crypto gains back to fiat to actually use it Except you don't. It's a currency. Just because it's hot right now and people are treating it like an investment doesn't change the fact that it's a currency itself. You don't need to convert it to anything. It was literally built to be a currency free from bank/government control. That was the whole point. The sole criterion for the…

I'm speaking in the hypothetical where crypto is regulated or banned. If you can't legally use it to trade where you physically reside you either need to convert to fiat overseas or buy your physical goods or services overseas. In either case the government isn't going to turn a blind eye "just because".

Re: CEO of a top Bitcoin exchange warns: crackdown on cryptocurrencies may be coming

#80

Post by puranjay »

kec wrote: post #44
tinus_hn wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can’t reliably restrict what you can’t see

At some point you need to convert your crypto gains back to fiat to actually use it, especially in the hypothetical case where crypto trade is banned locally. The IRS/FBI/etc are not going to arbitrarily constrain themselves when trying to go after folks who do this.

Nigeria banned banks from trading in crypto, killing off the fiat.

Nigerians just started making telegram and whatsapp groups, made codenames for different coins and traded them for cash or bank transfers.

Unless you decide to bank commerce and phones and the internet and talking to your neighbor and running a computer, you can't ban crypto.

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