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Bitcoin's vast energy use could burst its bubble

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Bitcoin's vast energy use could burst its bubble

#31

Post by throwamon »

briefcomment wrote: post #8
jmfldn wrote: post #2

""If Bitcoin were to be adopted as a global reserve currency," he speculates, "the Bitcoin price will probably be in the millions, and those miners will have more money than the entire [US] Federal budget to spend on electricity." "We'd have to double our global energy production," he says with a laugh. "For Bitcoin." He says it also limits the number of transactions the system can process to about five per second. T…

People just want an asset that can't be manipulated away. If it takes tons of energy, or if it totally changes power dynamics, or if we need to transact in different ways, then so be it. No one is going to give up the opportunity to own something like this for any reason. Regardless of whether people like it or not, they will have to adapt, since there is probably no viable way to stop something like this when people…

> then so be it

yeah, and fuck living in an inhabitable planet

Re: Bitcoin's vast energy use could burst its bubble

#32

Post by newnamenewface »

briefcomment wrote: post #8
jmfldn wrote: post #2

""If Bitcoin were to be adopted as a global reserve currency," he speculates, "the Bitcoin price will probably be in the millions, and those miners will have more money than the entire [US] Federal budget to spend on electricity." "We'd have to double our global energy production," he says with a laugh. "For Bitcoin." He says it also limits the number of transactions the system can process to about five per second. T…

People just want an asset that can't be manipulated away. If it takes tons of energy, or if it totally changes power dynamics, or if we need to transact in different ways, then so be it. No one is going to give up the opportunity to own something like this for any reason. Regardless of whether people like it or not, they will have to adapt, since there is probably no viable way to stop something like this when people…

Well, there's one very real way that complex financial instruments disappear in a huff. Bitcoin has only existed for less than 15 years. There's no indication that it's invincible to, say, a bubble burst and rapid permanent devaluation besides it having not happened yet. If in 86 years this is still the case, you could maybe convince me I won't see it in my lifetime, but just barely.

Re: Bitcoin's vast energy use could burst its bubble

#34

Post by HenryKissinger »

mareko wrote: post #9

Luckily there is a whole new generation of PoS networks that don't rely on proof of work. Some even automatically buy carbon offset credits to maintain a carbon neural footprint.

I've been reading about proof of stake cryptocurrencies for years, and how they will solve the problem of bitcoin's energy usage. Yet the problem persists.

What will it take to end bitcoin's predominance?

Re: Bitcoin's vast energy use could burst its bubble

#35

Post by stblack »

The total value of Bitcoin produced and changed as fees is presently in the order of US$50M per day.

Miners are competing very profitably, on aggregate, for this amount of money daily.

Therefore the full-factor cost of the global Bitcoin network is under $50M per day.

So whatever these people say about global energy use, it's under $50M per day.

Re: Bitcoin's vast energy use could burst its bubble

#37

Post by pavlov »

briefcomment wrote: post #8
jmfldn wrote: post #2

""If Bitcoin were to be adopted as a global reserve currency," he speculates, "the Bitcoin price will probably be in the millions, and those miners will have more money than the entire [US] Federal budget to spend on electricity." "We'd have to double our global energy production," he says with a laugh. "For Bitcoin." He says it also limits the number of transactions the system can process to about five per second. T…

People just want an asset that can't be manipulated away. If it takes tons of energy, or if it totally changes power dynamics, or if we need to transact in different ways, then so be it. No one is going to give up the opportunity to own something like this for any reason. Regardless of whether people like it or not, they will have to adapt, since there is probably no viable way to stop something like this when people…

Many people would choose to dump toxic waste into a river if they can make some money off it. They want it, but that doesn’t mean we have no way to stop them.

Re: Bitcoin's vast energy use could burst its bubble

#38

Post by EarthLaunch »

briefcomment wrote: post #8
jmfldn wrote: post #2

""If Bitcoin were to be adopted as a global reserve currency," he speculates, "the Bitcoin price will probably be in the millions, and those miners will have more money than the entire [US] Federal budget to spend on electricity." "We'd have to double our global energy production," he says with a laugh. "For Bitcoin." He says it also limits the number of transactions the system can process to about five per second. T…

People just want an asset that can't be manipulated away. If it takes tons of energy, or if it totally changes power dynamics, or if we need to transact in different ways, then so be it. No one is going to give up the opportunity to own something like this for any reason. Regardless of whether people like it or not, they will have to adapt, since there is probably no viable way to stop something like this when people…

People want such an asset, but it absolutely can viably be stopped. Governments outlawing it will lower the price and utility. Governments doing a 50% attack or similar will end it.

What's interesting to me is that Proof of Work competes with government's Proof of Force.

I wonder, is this a choice between running the world on math (or profit) versus running the world on democracy (or force)?

Re: Bitcoin's vast energy use could burst its bubble

#39

Post by varajelle »

poundofshrimp wrote: post #13
pier25 wrote: post #7

At some point mining will stop and energy use will only amount to running the blockchain nodes. How far are we from the total number of Bitcoins the system allows?

If you mean the hashing will stop - it won’t, because that’s how the system is secured. The creation of new bitcoins is irrelevant as far as energy use goes.

The creation of new bitcoin is what incentives miner to spend so much. When the reward go down, the miners would presumably spend less energy. (But it has so far been offset by the increase of value of bitcoin itself.)

Re: Bitcoin's vast energy use could burst its bubble

#40

Post by BobbyJo »

briefcomment wrote: post #8
jmfldn wrote: post #2

""If Bitcoin were to be adopted as a global reserve currency," he speculates, "the Bitcoin price will probably be in the millions, and those miners will have more money than the entire [US] Federal budget to spend on electricity." "We'd have to double our global energy production," he says with a laugh. "For Bitcoin." He says it also limits the number of transactions the system can process to about five per second. T…

People just want an asset that can't be manipulated away. If it takes tons of energy, or if it totally changes power dynamics, or if we need to transact in different ways, then so be it. No one is going to give up the opportunity to own something like this for any reason. Regardless of whether people like it or not, they will have to adapt, since there is probably no viable way to stop something like this when people…

Blockchains would be easy to stop if governments wanted. The power footprint of miners is easy to find, and wallets and transactions are easy to trace. The reality is, if a blockchain ever got large enough and widespread enough to impact a host government's currency, it could be shut down probably overnight.
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