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The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

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Re: The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

#51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What time do they start work in the US?

My daughter's school starts at 7am, so she has to be up by 5:45am. It's stupid.

Ah. That's indeed early.

In France kindergarten and primary school starts at 8:30 and ends at 16:30. Mid and high school at 8 or 9, never earlier.

This is very early for children and teens, really not physiological.

Re: The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

#52
post #19

While 27 minutes nighttime sleep didn't affect outcomes, another effect they observed was that afternoon naps DID increase productivity and well being. So it's not that more sleep can't help -- maybe it depends on specific type of work / life situation?

Naps are great. Taking 20 minutes of nap turned my afternoons from distraction zone into my most productive time.

Re: The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

#53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Throwaway as I don't want to admit that I feel permanently cognitively impaired. Anecdotal, but I spent years not sleeping through university and sleeping in airports or on the train. Studied engineering and did a lot of hackathons and events and stuff. I figured out then that I didn't need full cognition or excellent decision making. I needed more hours cranking out work. I spent years sleeping just a few hours and…

From your description, it's possible that you have undiagnosed ADHD, though probably not caused by lack of sleep. It's always worth talking to a doctor about these things — there might be a way to get your focus back.

I second this. I have been diagnosed with ADHD as an adult, and my experience, before medication, sounded very similar.

Re: The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

#54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What time do they start work in the US?

My daughter's school starts at 7am, so she has to be up by 5:45am. It's stupid.

In my country it's the same, I think it is done that way because most people jobs start at 8 or 9, there's no school bus system, only private transport for kids going to school, so this schedule gives a chance for parents to drop off their kids at school and make it to work afterwards.

Personally I hated it at the time, because getting up early is not my thing, but now I appreciate the time I got to talk with my parents on my way to school thanks to that schedule arrangement.

Also to offset this early getting up, we jus went to bed earlier, like at 9pm or 10pm max, so not sure it really made a difference on anything.

Re: The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

#55
post #16

short afternoon naps at the workplace improved an overall index of outcomes by 0.12 standard deviations, with significant increases in productivity, psychological well-being, and cognition Is it possible to learn that? To me it seems impossible to do a "short nap". Even when I feel low energy, I don't feel like I could just lay down and sleep during the day.

Yes. I do 20 minutes of nap most afternoons, and it helps immensely. Though "nap" is a misnomer, I don't actually try to sleep, just sit or lie comfortably with my eyes closed and as few noises and interruptions as possible. A 20 minute timer has taught my body to get ready to work again after exactly 20 minutes. The goal is to let the mind relax for a bit.

Re: The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

#56
post #5
post #3

Those in the study were low-income adults in Chennai, India who sleep only 5.5 hours per night on average despite spending 8 hours in bed. The key takeaway was: > increased nighttime sleep had no detectable effects on cognition, productivity, decision-making, or well-being, and led to small decreases in labor supply. I find the result surprising. When I get under 6 hours I see a clear drop off in performance.

> increased sleep duration by 27 minutes per night by inducing more time in bed Maybe 27 minutes is just not enough? I’m sure the results would be different if they started to get 7 hours instead of 5.5.

My thoughts as well. They still got less than 6 hours a night, and were already in a state of constant sleep deprivation.

Re: The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

#57

No offense, but why was this question even asked? What are the people's needs in the first place? I saw a similar study that suggested the best way to improve mental health and economic consequences among the poor is to *drumroll give them money. Then they will create sustainable interventions that don't require source of money to improve the lives.

Plenty of offense: why are you even asking why they're doing research into ways to improve people's well-being, especially poor people? Yes, giving money helps, I'm all for UBI, but maybe there are other approaches that are cheaper or complement UBI. How about we find out and _improve people's lives_?

Re: The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

#58
post #5
post #3

Those in the study were low-income adults in Chennai, India who sleep only 5.5 hours per night on average despite spending 8 hours in bed. The key takeaway was: > increased nighttime sleep had no detectable effects on cognition, productivity, decision-making, or well-being, and led to small decreases in labor supply. I find the result surprising. When I get under 6 hours I see a clear drop off in performance.

> increased sleep duration by 27 minutes per night by inducing more time in bed Maybe 27 minutes is just not enough? I’m sure the results would be different if they started to get 7 hours instead of 5.5.

+1. Though remember we're talking averages, and different people have different sleep needs. One would think some of them saw enough increase in sleep quality to show up in the stats.

Re: The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My daughter's school starts at 7am, so she has to be up by 5:45am. It's stupid.

In my country it's the same, I think it is done that way because most people jobs start at 8 or 9, there's no school bus system, only private transport for kids going to school, so this schedule gives a chance for parents to drop off their kids at school and make it to work afterwards. Personally I hated it at the time, because getting up early is not my thing, but now I appreciate the time I got to talk with my pare…

In the USA, school schedules are at least partially dictated by after-school sports. Classes need to end early enough that teams can practice in daylight.

Re: The Economic Consequences of Increasing Sleep Among the Urban Poor

#60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my country it's the same, I think it is done that way because most people jobs start at 8 or 9, there's no school bus system, only private transport for kids going to school, so this schedule gives a chance for parents to drop off their kids at school and make it to work afterwards. Personally I hated it at the time, because getting up early is not my thing, but now I appreciate the time I got to talk with my pare…

In the USA, school schedules are at least partially dictated by after-school sports. Classes need to end early enough that teams can practice in daylight.

Yeah we had those too, sun goes down at around 6pm all year round here though, training would take place 3pm - 5pm for extracurricular activities
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