A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers • Hacker News Board

Re: A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers

#101

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Apr 10, 2021, 3:47 PM UTC

ahelwer wrote: post #70

ThinkBeat wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for sharing that. I was not aware of the term, but I have been aware of the idea. In a narrow manner I have seen this up close. The people some call Antifa, a term they also use themselves, will show up for protests and demonstrations. Nobody invited them, many would prefer that they were not there. In general, they detract fromt the message of the protests. Black clad people with various accoutrements need…

As someone with quite a few left-wing friends, this comment was pretty funny to read. I have no idea why people think they can pick apart the inner machinations of the minds of people they've seemingly never spoken to, not into whose ideology they have the slightest insight or interest. Very strong "boomer opining at their suburban kitchen table about the problem with today's youths" energy. Any given person who iden…

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Re: A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers

#102

Post by Grieving » Sat, Apr 10, 2021, 4:00 PM UTC

One of the worst problems of our political discourse (aside from the idea of a single political axis) is the idea that extremism results from distance from the center. There's nothing about this man's political perspective (that we know) suggesting he was in any way far-right. He is, if anything, a 'center-right' extremist.

Same kind of idea goes for proud boys, boogaloos, etc. I think they like the 'far-right' designation because it lets them liken these groups to fascism, which is about as accurate as likening AOC to Stalin.

Re: A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers

#103

Post by madaxe_again » Sat, Apr 10, 2021, 4:38 PM UTC

roenxi wrote: post #74

WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #2

Far Right Extremist seems to be an accurate label. Using the screen name Dionysus, he posted on MyMilitia.com, a forum dedicated to organizing militia groups, about his plan to “conduct a little experiment” in 2021. “I’m not a dumbass suicide bomber,” Pendley wrote. “But even if I only have a handful of fellow patriots standing beside me, I will happily die a young man knowing that I didn’t allow the evils in this wo…

Yeah, I don't think the right wing can disown this one. Illegal methods are obviously unacceptable and this guy is a loser, but after the last election the right wing needs to be honest about the situation. One of their biggest political opponents is the big tech companies and they need to organise against them.

The big tech companies aren’t opponents of the right wing - they are the right wing - they want low taxes, reduced governmental oversight, and are vast multi billion dollar for-profit corporations.

They do oppose extremist far right content. Not the political movement, but rather the content which they cannot legally host without facing repercussions themselves.

Re: A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers

#104

Post by luckylion » Sat, Apr 10, 2021, 5:13 PM UTC

bananaface wrote: post #90

luckylion wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They don't perceive The Man as sadistic, they perceive him as disinterested. This doesn't fit with the whole oppression thing where essentially everything is done to hurt $class, $minority, or $cause. The social thing seems accurate. There are far right networks, but their violent extremists appear to be mostly loners, which seems to be extremely rare on the far left. The gender distribution is a good point as well…

The left-wing narrative is usually "[group A] is hurt by [issue and thus group B]", whereas the far-right is, "[group C] will hurt you, if you let them." I think it's a deliberate difference. The far right would never say Jews were accidentally conspiring against Americans, it wouldn't help them. But it helps the far left to say their issues are inadvertent, that [villain] can't help his bias, or that he doesn't have…

I'm not sure, class warfare isn't a thing that's accidentally happening according to those that subscribe to the theory, it's intentional. Not as a genocidal "let's annihilate the lower class" war, but to perpetually oppress, enslave and exploit them.

The Great Purge didn't consider its targets as accidentally doing harm, they were portrayed as a "fifth column" that sought to destroy the Soviet Union. That external enemy is what creates group cohesion and strengthens the resolve of members. "They're just people like you and me, but the circumstances make their behavior harmful to those people over there" isn't what you mobilize with, so we get White Supremacy behind everything or Patriarchy conspiracies that read like The Protocols.

Re: A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers

#105

Post by jariel » Sat, Apr 10, 2021, 5:36 PM UTC

People were told by other people in positions of legitimate authority that the election was literally stolen. Effectively meaning that the Republic has been usurped and democracy trampled.

Imagine, wherever you live, if some 'bad guys' actually did that: stuff ballots, silence officials, push through a win.

There are three reasons I can think of some kind of legit call to arms:

1) Your country is being invaded 2) Communists or Fascists are literally taking over the world. 3) Your government has been usurped in a coup etc.. Given the number of people who live in the fake news bubble and truly believe the election was a fraud, I'm surprised there isn't more of this.

Actually, it's unfathomable that there hasn't been some kind of armed attempt at 'something' when >100M people truly believe the election was not legit and they have guns.

It's made me think that a lot of Trumpers who believe that the election was stolen, don't truly believe it, rather, they just 'want to believe it' - as a mental cover for their loss. "The election was rigged" more or less as a slogan, not actually a fact.

Re: A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers

#106

Post by _teyd » Sat, Apr 10, 2021, 6:11 PM UTC

dempseye wrote: post #51

_teyd wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whataboutism doesnt mean that what was brought up is not true, just that it distracts from the original criticism. The classic example is “Soviet Union has problems? Well, look how the US is treating black people.”

If someone is criticizing you in bad faith, and from a position of utter hypocrisy, it is fair enough to point that out. There is nothing to gain from battling an adversary like that on their terms.

Sure, I am just commenting on the statement that it is not whataboutism because it is true.

Re: A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers

#107

Post by WesolyKubeczek » Sat, Apr 10, 2021, 6:15 PM UTC

slim wrote: post #44

_Microft wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wonder, does such a person share a lot of characteristics of his mental state with someone who on the other side of the political spectrum This sounds like the "horseshoe theory": "In political science and popular discourse, the horseshoe theory asserts that the far-left and the far-right, rather than being at opposite and opposing ends of a linear political continuum, closely resemble one another, analogous to t…

moebius strip would describe this more accurately than a horse shoe

I thought of a donut shape, but Möbius strip is good too.

Re: A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers

#108

Post by CompanionCubee » Sat, Apr 10, 2021, 6:22 PM UTC

DanBC wrote: post #53

aww_dang wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While the riots of last summer were not characterized as terrorism, they were instances of political violence resulting in massive property damage and multiple deaths. https://www.google.com/search?q=fiery+but+mostly+peaceful There's a palatable element of partisanship distorting the presentation of these issues. Instead of looking for equivalence or ranking which side is worse, perhaps we should blanketly condemn po…

> While the riots of last summer were not characterized as terrorism, You can see how this destroys anything that you're about to say, right? To try to engage with your point: there's a difference between a demonstration (BLM) and bombing a church (far right). There's a difference between riots (BLM) and mass murder at a synagogue (far right). There's a difference between organising a march (BLM) and driving cars int…

>> While the riots of last summer were not characterized as terrorism,

>You can see how this destroys anything that you're about to say, right?

Not so much, unless you would like to dispute that riots count as violence. Or that terrorism is politically motivated violence. :)

Re: A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers

#109

Post by felixgallo » Sat, Apr 10, 2021, 7:11 PM UTC

aww_dang wrote: post #93

felixgallo wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

at the end of the day, it is important which flavor is actually terrorism, and the fact that it tends to be concentrated in neo-islamic and neo-fascist right wing people is a tool that we can use to help fix the problem.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO https://www.aclu.org/blog/national-security/discriminatory-p... 1) Given that those succumbing to group think and confirmation bias are generally unaware of their biases, how would we know that we are not experiencing something similar now? 2) What are the implications for civil liberties, if the state targets political opponents of the current administration? 3) Could these i…

what are the implications for civil liberties, if the state targets terrorists? It's probably not great. But it's probably better than having more Oklahoma City bombings or capitol building attempted insurrections.

Could 'these issues be resolved targeting political violence generally, instead of making partisan pleas and accusations'? No -- in factual reality world, there is an ideology which is responsible for the problem, and so it seems sensible to focus on that ideology. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/22/white-supremac...

"are these partisan blame games contributing to the climate of toxic political divisiveness"? I'll tell you what's contributing to the climate of toxic political divisiveness -- overwhelmingly, the right wing, its conspiracy theorists, and their enablers; see, for example, qanon/8chan, the count of trump's lies while in office. These are radical outliers. Let's worry about that before we start worrying about the impact of us complaining about that.

Re: A far-right extremist allegedly plotted to blow up Amazon data centers

#110

Post by lamontcg » Sat, Apr 10, 2021, 7:55 PM UTC

madaxe_again wrote: post #103

roenxi wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I don't think the right wing can disown this one. Illegal methods are obviously unacceptable and this guy is a loser, but after the last election the right wing needs to be honest about the situation. One of their biggest political opponents is the big tech companies and they need to organise against them.

The big tech companies aren’t opponents of the right wing - they are the right wing - they want low taxes, reduced governmental oversight, and are vast multi billion dollar for-profit corporations. They do oppose extremist far right content. Not the political movement, but rather the content which they cannot legally host without facing repercussions themselves.

This is the right wing losing control of the far right wing.