How often can these votes take place?
Because I'd expect support to rise next time something Amazon does annoys its employees.
Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama
181–190 of 1001 posts
Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama
#182Why are people in America against unionizing? In Spain and I think in Europe it's pretty normal, most people do it.
Unions in the EU have very different rules than unions in the US. In particular, American unions can essentially force an employer to become a "closed shop" through a majority vote. Everyone who works there then has to pay union dues and accept a union contract. EU unions involve more worker choice.
Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama
#183I absolutely do not understand why you would vote against your own collective interest for a small amount of union dues. That is not snark, it's a real statement. I legitimately do not understand it. Can someone who works/worked one of these jobs please explain it to me? I am so confused by how lopsided this was.
I personally enjoyed the flexibility of the "at-will" job.
I grabbed a position at a Minnesota warehouse as a post-college graduate with no fulltime job. Kinda just wandered in off some job posting online and they just brought me on.
Feels like people just don't want to mess with a good thing tho? A lot of my friends came from super different walks of life, but almost all unanimously enjoyed coming in for shifts and shooting the shit with their friends. Might just be a perception that change means that things will get worse and no one wants that.
Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama
#184I absolutely do not understand why you would vote against your own collective interest for a small amount of union dues. That is not snark, it's a real statement. I legitimately do not understand it. Can someone who works/worked one of these jobs please explain it to me? I am so confused by how lopsided this was.
I wonder if it helped democracy if voters would be able to add "justification" to their vote. Then there would be less room for speculation about the reasons.
The data would be nice, but it seems like this would have a chilling effect on the vote itself. The extra context of a justification would make it easier to tie votes to groups or even individuals. I'm not sure why, but polls as a separate, voluntary activity seem like a safer way to do it.
Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama
#185I absolutely do not understand why you would vote against your own collective interest for a small amount of union dues. That is not snark, it's a real statement. I legitimately do not understand it. Can someone who works/worked one of these jobs please explain it to me? I am so confused by how lopsided this was.
Also dues are not compulsive because it's a "write to work" state. Insanity.
It is "right to work" and I do not see how it is insane to not _force_ people to join unions. In the US we take our freedoms of association seriously and forcing a citizen to associate with an organization they do not wish to associate with is tantamount to an unconstitutionality.
Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama
#186HN is very consistently anti-union. My question is this: Where did you get information about unions? Because people keep mentioning their "bad reputation" and then start listing off a bunch of "facts" that read like they're bullets straight out of one of those anti-union videos during onboard at several major employers (Walmart, Target, Amazon, etc). So anti-union people exactly where does your information come from?…
Me personally is anti-monopoly.
If a union can only operate by forming a workforce monopoly - something is wrong with the model itself.
Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama
#187Thank god and whoever else for this. This is amazing. I realize and understand a segment of HN readers are sympathetic to unions(the American version too), and some are vocal advocates as well, but I am absolutely elated at this outcome.
Edit: Question: Can this vote also be taken as a proxy indicator of the working conditions not being anywhere close to what the sensational and click-bait media pieces point out to be?
Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama
#188Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama
#189Good. I have lived in 3 continents and 4 different countries and I have yet to see a union that is not run by and for the lazy and incompetent, ultimately to the ruin of all involved. I hear Germany cracked the code on that one, but in the US unions seem to be pretty much like everywhere.
I have a few German customers and I also get the impression that their unions seem to work.
It seems to be a result of multiple factors:
1. "Mitbestimmung" or co-determination. German workers elect the board of directors.
2. Labor reps vote alongside shareholders
3. Laborers in the same strata form "work councils" and choose reps to bring issues to managers or higher up the chain
4. "Betriebsverfassungsgesetz" federal laws giving workers the rights to form these work councils
The people i've spoken too (anecdotal, I know) don't seem to have the same hostility to the unions. It is just kinda accepted and "normal" that the union is going to be there so they seem to work with them instead of fighting them at every step.
Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama
#190Earlier quoted context omitted.
I absolutely abhor modern day versions of unions. They have not done enough to separate themselves in my eyes from the misguided activities that brought them their current negative reputations. However, I absolutely understand the need, and feel sorry for those stuck in a sitation where union type help is needed. If there was a way to wipe out existing unions and start fresh where nobody from leadership of exisiting…
The more I read about Unions in America the more I am befuddled. Don’t you have membership elections for the leadership? How do you even decide who the leadership is then? If you do have elections, then your comment is akin to a republican proclaiming that democracy doesn’t work, but would work in principle but only of the current leadership was replace with Donal Trump.
>Don’t you have membership elections for the leadership?
So does Iran, Russia, etc. Do you feel like those elections are free and fair? I don't feel like union leadership votes are. Again, there's a lot of baggage associated with current unions. New unions are needed, not new leadership of existing unions.