Why Hypercard had to die (2011)
41–50 of 171 posts
Re: Why Hypercard had to die (2011)
#42Re: Why Hypercard had to die (2011)
#43There is a disturbing tendency to try to sideline imperfect, but productive and accessible programming environments in favor of both more complicated, heavyweight "real" programmer languages, or on the other extreme, extremely limited no-code/low-code solutions that are frustrating and impossible to do anything beyond toy workflows. This ground that HyperCard or Visual Basic 6 or Flash occupied has been ruthlessly ra…
why build software that empowers people to also build software easily, when you can charge thousand of €s in consultancy fees
Re: Why Hypercard had to die (2011)
#44Jobs had the balls to do to Hypercard what Adobe didn't do to Flash. If Hypercard was so amazing then why did products like Supercard fail. It matched Hypercard's feature set and was able to run on Windows and Macs.
Re: Why Hypercard had to die (2011)
#45Re: Why Hypercard had to die (2011)
#46Obviously not exactly the same, but a lot of the magic here is something I felt with Macromedia Flash MX back in the day. I had been (at the time) unsuccessful getting a C++ with OpenGL project working, but when I had my pirated copy of Flash, I was very quickly able to make interactive stuff. I never made anything even close to "commercial-ready", but I had a lot of fun doing it. It felt like within a day or two, yo…
Re: Why Hypercard had to die (2011)
#47It has one interesting point: complexity is our industry’s addiction and downfall, but blames the wrong person. it’s not Steve Jobs’ fault that customers want what they want.
The dream that we’d all be in a web based on HyperCard is no different from other the Squeak Smalltalk folks or LOGO fans etc. Elegant, beautiful interactive environments to help people learn computers, but never became mainstream problem solvers. It’s an old tale.
Otherwise it is mostly a “get off my lawn” rant.
(For those that don’t know about Squeak, Alan Kay believed in children’s programming so much they went to Disney - Disney! - to create Squeak, named after Mickey Mouse, as a next gen Smalltalk for kids.)
Re: Why Hypercard had to die (2011)
#48If you extend Hypercard to its logical conclusion you get either Flash or a browser running HTML locally. In any case you get a security nightmare, a lot of duplicated efforts, and the need to solve hard problems which didn't exist back then such as adapting UI to different screen sizes, accessibility, internationalization, publishing stacks on the web, etc.
Also, there were some commercial products developed with Hypercard back in the day... but these days you'd need a different development environment that supports things like versioning to entertain that possibility.
Re: Why Hypercard had to die (2011)
#49Jobs had the balls to do to Hypercard what Adobe didn't do to Flash. If Hypercard was so amazing then why did products like Supercard fail. It matched Hypercard's feature set and was able to run on Windows and Macs.
Re: Why Hypercard had to die (2011)
#50Earlier quoted context omitted.
> World Wide Web accomplished basically the same thing, This is incorrect and I'm convinced that you agree after you think it little more. HyperCard was tool for non-programmers. Like spreadsheet. Web is not alternative to HyperCard. You have to learn web programming to do anything. We should not get over it, but create replacement or recreate it.
The Web was a gateway tech for a whole generation of “non programmers”, and for at least its first 10-15 years (through 2005 or so) you could build reasonable sites without being a programmer. But as with all simple things in tech, there are more people whose pay depends on complexity. And so Web 2.0 rose and CSS+JavaScript became what it is today.
(If anything, it's easier today to build a circa-2005 style site than it was in 2005! The native API has grown up enough that you don't need jQuery any more, and honestly good riddance.)
The trouble with the circa-2005 web is that it wasn't actually all that simple. You still had similar complexity to what people do today, but not very many ways to make that complexity manageable. So it was very easy to create situations in which things went wrong a lot and you couldn't really figure out why - something I think the rosy glow of nostalgia easily obscures, these days.
My early career, in hindsight, really was built on dealing with that kind of "unfixable" complexity, finding ways to reduce or replace it or at least make it more manageable - if often just in self-defense, as I typically was also largely responsible for maintaining the same stuff I built. The "capstone project" of that phase was something that we would today describe as an SPA, built in 2011 when the concept barely existed - I hadn't set out to (re)invent that wheel, nor did I even understand until a few years later that that was what I had done, but I found my way to it as the only reasonable option for coping with the essential complexity of the user interaction it expressed, and it worked really well!
That work was for one of our biggest contracts, which we were at risk of losing if I didn't find a way to fix their broken and unusable registration process. It would probably have sunk the company if I'd failed. Reworking it into an SPA avant la lettre solved the problem and saved the contract, and it was some of the hardest work I've ever done precisely because, at that time, there were no tools to help manage all that complexity. It's only gotten easier since then, as successive frameworks have built on prior work in removing accidental complexity and making essential complexity easier to express and manage.
Yes, today's tools are themselves more complicated than jQuery or whatever, sure. That's fair. You need to spend more time learning how to get the most out of them, that's also true. But the tools also do more, and largely do it in ways that are worth having.
A Bridgeport mill takes a lot more learning than a chisel, too, and you can do a lot more damage with a Bridgeport mill used wrongly. Used rightly, though, you can achieve far more with a Bridgeport mill, far more quickly and easily, than any chisel in the history of the world could ever let you do.