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A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

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Re: A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

#51

Post by TaupeRanger »

tediousdemise wrote: post #47

The code contains things that make any modern C++ or Rust developer cringe: naked pointers, unsafe type casts, raw loops, using malloc/free to manually allocate memory for buffers, and calls to unsafe free functions like strcat. So much slow boilerplate is required to do things like handling memory allocation. The increased source code size for even the simplest things becomes harder to maintain. Danger is waiting ar…

C with Asan or Valgrind is faster to write and just as performant (usually better) as Rust or C++. There's a reason the world runs on C, and only part of it is historical.

Re: A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

#52

Post by orf »

slezyr wrote: post #50
tediousdemise wrote: post #47

The code contains things that make any modern C++ or Rust developer cringe: naked pointers, unsafe type casts, raw loops, using malloc/free to manually allocate memory for buffers, and calls to unsafe free functions like strcat. So much slow boilerplate is required to do things like handling memory allocation. The increased source code size for even the simplest things becomes harder to maintain. Danger is waiting ar…

> The alternative is that you could be using a language that uses highly optimized RAII types on the stack which are impossible to leak, and written by some of the best programmers in the world so you don’t have to juggle chainsaws. Please, tell "the best programmers" that it's "impossible to leak" memory. Apparently they do not know this. https://doc.rust-lang.org/book/ch15-06-reference-cycles.html

Leak can mean different things. None of those types in the link are stack allocated, I think.

Re: A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

#53

Post by tediousdemise »

slezyr wrote: post #50
tediousdemise wrote: post #47

The code contains things that make any modern C++ or Rust developer cringe: naked pointers, unsafe type casts, raw loops, using malloc/free to manually allocate memory for buffers, and calls to unsafe free functions like strcat. So much slow boilerplate is required to do things like handling memory allocation. The increased source code size for even the simplest things becomes harder to maintain. Danger is waiting ar…

> The alternative is that you could be using a language that uses highly optimized RAII types on the stack which are impossible to leak, and written by some of the best programmers in the world so you don’t have to juggle chainsaws. Please, tell "the best programmers" that it's "impossible to leak" memory. Apparently they do not know this. https://doc.rust-lang.org/book/ch15-06-reference-cycles.html

Thanks for sharing, I’m unfamiliar with the nuances of Rust’s implementation of RAII as I’m primarily a modern C++ developer. Modern C++ mostly guarantees against leaks since it encourages the stack as much possible.

https://github.com/isocpp/CppCoreGuidelines/blob/master/CppC...

Re: A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

#54

Post by mpfundstein »

tediousdemise wrote: post #47

The code contains things that make any modern C++ or Rust developer cringe: naked pointers, unsafe type casts, raw loops, using malloc/free to manually allocate memory for buffers, and calls to unsafe free functions like strcat. So much slow boilerplate is required to do things like handling memory allocation. The increased source code size for even the simplest things becomes harder to maintain. Danger is waiting ar…

C is very fun to write. You get down to the machine level (nearly). Op did so because he probably wanted to just use it. Maybe to study it, maybe to learn how to write in an unsafe language.

You can program Rust if you want and all you want and feel safe by doing so. Feel free. But this reply really does not contribute anything of value. Especially not for Op. Ofc there are languages with better abstractions reg memory and concurrency. But who cares? its Op's freedom to use whatever he wants to use.

and btw. this attitude is precisely why so many people think Rusters are fucking annoying.

Re: A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

#55

Post by tediousdemise »

TaupeRanger wrote: post #51
tediousdemise wrote: post #47

The code contains things that make any modern C++ or Rust developer cringe: naked pointers, unsafe type casts, raw loops, using malloc/free to manually allocate memory for buffers, and calls to unsafe free functions like strcat. So much slow boilerplate is required to do things like handling memory allocation. The increased source code size for even the simplest things becomes harder to maintain. Danger is waiting ar…

C with Asan or Valgrind is faster to write and just as performant (usually better) as Rust or C++. There's a reason the world runs on C, and only part of it is historical.

I just can’t recommend using it for new code in light of the sexy new alternatives that can compile down to the same binary with source code that’s way more intuitive and readable.

I do have nostalgia for C since it was my first language, and I think a lot of people are in the same boat, which is a problem. That’s why I think we need to stop teaching C. Kate Gregory has a good cppcon talk on the topic: https://youtu.be/YnWhqhNdYyk

Re: A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

#56

Post by allo37 »

tediousdemise wrote: post #53
slezyr wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The alternative is that you could be using a language that uses highly optimized RAII types on the stack which are impossible to leak, and written by some of the best programmers in the world so you don’t have to juggle chainsaws. Please, tell "the best programmers" that it's "impossible to leak" memory. Apparently they do not know this. https://doc.rust-lang.org/book/ch15-06-reference-cycles.html

Thanks for sharing, I’m unfamiliar with the nuances of Rust’s implementation of RAII as I’m primarily a modern C++ developer. Modern C++ mostly guarantees against leaks since it encourages the stack as much possible. https://github.com/isocpp/CppCoreGuidelines/blob/master/CppC...

It's the same deal as creating a circular references using `std::shared_ptr` in C++.

Re: A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

#57

Post by adrianN »

TaupeRanger wrote: post #51
tediousdemise wrote: post #47

The code contains things that make any modern C++ or Rust developer cringe: naked pointers, unsafe type casts, raw loops, using malloc/free to manually allocate memory for buffers, and calls to unsafe free functions like strcat. So much slow boilerplate is required to do things like handling memory allocation. The increased source code size for even the simplest things becomes harder to maintain. Danger is waiting ar…

C with Asan or Valgrind is faster to write and just as performant (usually better) as Rust or C++. There's a reason the world runs on C, and only part of it is historical.

Now you just need to also write a testsuite that covers every possible path through your code and you've proved the absence of errors that Valgrind can find. I'm not sure that building such a test suite is less work than using a safer language.

Re: A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

#58

Post by as-j »

tediousdemise wrote: post #47

The code contains things that make any modern C++ or Rust developer cringe: naked pointers, unsafe type casts, raw loops, using malloc/free to manually allocate memory for buffers, and calls to unsafe free functions like strcat. So much slow boilerplate is required to do things like handling memory allocation. The increased source code size for even the simplest things becomes harder to maintain. Danger is waiting ar…

Thanks is, as the GitHub title says, for iot and embedded devices.

There’s a whole class of these that don’t have the resources to run C++ or rust. Source: develop on a Linux system with 7 megabyte roofs and 16 megs of ram. Oh! We have a 1 meg application partition.

Re: A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

#59

Post by hctaw »

allo37 wrote: post #56
tediousdemise wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for sharing, I’m unfamiliar with the nuances of Rust’s implementation of RAII as I’m primarily a modern C++ developer. Modern C++ mostly guarantees against leaks since it encourages the stack as much possible. https://github.com/isocpp/CppCoreGuidelines/blob/master/CppC...

It's the same deal as creating a circular references using `std::shared_ptr` in C++.

Ownership semantics in rust largely prevent circular references, so it's not the same deal

Re: A simple C implementation to stream H.264 to browser using WebRTC

#60

Post by userbinator »

tediousdemise wrote: post #47

The code contains things that make any modern C++ or Rust developer cringe: naked pointers, unsafe type casts, raw loops, using malloc/free to manually allocate memory for buffers, and calls to unsafe free functions like strcat. So much slow boilerplate is required to do things like handling memory allocation. The increased source code size for even the simplest things becomes harder to maintain. Danger is waiting ar…

Perhaps you'd like to point out an actual bug you've found...?

This sort of dogmatic cargo-culting paranoia-rant is exactly why people are getting sick of hearing about the "modern" BS.

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