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Lithium battery costs have fallen by 98% in three decades

economist.com

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Re: Lithium battery costs have fallen by 98% in three decades

#421

Post by jdofaz »

Robotbeat wrote: post #215
callmeal wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Hrmm, so the cost and performance is much the same, but it adds value by creating a new talking point for Tesla owners to harangue others with. I know that hating on Tesla is a thing, but don't forget the higher torque, better efficiency, lower heat generation in the stator windings. And the fact that this type of motor first showed up in the Prius and Tesla made a better version of it. Yeah they're getting away wit…

I'm as big of a Tesla fan as any, but I'm both continuously impressed with how ahead-of-its-time the Prius was and continuously disappointed how lack-luster Toyota has been in pure electric cars. Toyota had like a decade lead on everyone else and just.... sat on it. Only invested in hybrids and hydrogen (which was and is a dead end). Toyota could've gone all-in on pure electric cars (and better plug-in hybrids than t…

In the early 2000s Chevron bought up the patent rights for NiMH batteries and refused to grant licenses for large batteries. Toyota was sued for patent infringement for their 90s RAV4EV and settled with Chevron.

Supposedly Tesla's early cars used off the shelf lithium ion laptop battery cells to get around these patent issues.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patent_encumbrance_of_large_au...

Re: Lithium battery costs have fallen by 98% in three decades

#422

Post by waheoo »

Qwertious wrote: post #297
terafo wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The real, more recent data is much, much worse. Where can I read anything on this?

There's a video on YouTube, Gwynne Dyer -- Geopolitics in a Hotter World (2010) ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mc_4Z1oiXhY ), which very briefly touches on it IIRC. I'm talking about the bit that starts at 8m30s on the video, but I highly recommend watching the whole thing (or at leas the 1-hour talk part - the Q&A is practically inaudible for me). Basically, the IPCC doesn't publish studies - they study compilati…

The (non political) conservatism is the major issue. They select for conservative non alarmist studies leaving more alarmist ones as outliers, the studies themselves do the same thing.

The compounding effect of this along with the time lag is just so damn disturbing.

Re: Lithium battery costs have fallen by 98% in three decades

#423

Post by iagovar »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #407
iagovar wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An expensive phone is about 500-1000€. A cheap EV is in the 20K neighborhood, and the functionality is pretty bad compared to a cheap second-hand utility car (pretty hard to travel outside your city). Even when regulations push prices up, it's still far more economical to buy a cheap gas car than a cheap EV. Even in Europe there are plenty of countries where many people can't afford an EV. They can afford second-hand…

"because nobody will pay for a charger installation in a rented flat" Where did you get this idea? People pay for an AC, a conciege, a cycle room, a roof terrace, a fucking gardener but they wont pay for a charging point? Also why does it have to be rented?

Most people in Europe lives in rented flats. A charger installation is rather expensive for most of us outside of a few selected countries.

People in Switzerland, Norway, or maybe some part of Germany may have no problem. For me it's a rather heavy price.

Not to mention dumping capital on an asset which isn't even yours. No thanks.

Re: Lithium battery costs have fallen by 98% in three decades

#424

Post by r00fus »

bluGill wrote: post #237
r00fus wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Global Warming is changing that. Anecdotally in my observations, more new houses in France now have AC whereas it was rare only 5 years ago.

Global warming is not that much difference. People just can afford ac now so they buy it.

Given I have skipped last year (due to COVID) but we'd been in France every summer for the previous 5 years and it's gotten hotter and hotter - resulting successive record breaking summers.

I think the decline of the jet stream is a bigger deal for Europe than the US. Hotter summers and colder winters.

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